Squinny
Forum Replies Created
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Hi Mike - While I personally dont see the point of such a product maybe try a type of body butter bar and play around with percentages. I think you need to add something like Cetyl Alcohol , Stearic Acid? Anyway something like:this may be what you are after (or not) -
Cocoa Butter 60%, Mango Butter 10% (OR 70% Cocoa butter) Oils like coconut or sunflower as cheap about 10%, Cetyl Alcohol 9% and Stearic Acid 8%, Beeswax (or Vegan sub if thats what you are after? around 3%. Play around with such ingredients until you get the consistency you want. Just do a small batch like 50g to start. Assume you have a procedure for making these and a silicone mould? -
Perry said:Unfortunately, most of the magnesium hydroxide you would use is synthetic too. https://www.garrisonminerals.com/post/how-magnesium-hydroxide-is-made
And also “Commercial brucite, a worldwide used raw material deemed safe, can be contaminated by asbestos” - https://rosa.uniroma1.it/rosa04/periodico_di_mineralogia/article/view/17384
There is a reason that mainstream cosmetic companies don’t use this technology any longer…other things just work better.
To your pH question, you’ll have to give more of the formula to answer that. How much are you using?
Hi Perry - I reckon you would make a fortune by doing a “Natural and Other” Deodorant formulations course
Thanks for this great forum by the way. PS I love your Cat in your video with Amanda Fox_hill you did a while ago - He/she is very cute My icon is my girl cat Leah (ragdoll) and we have her brother Max as well - -
kivangel said:@ngarayeva001 thank you so much! That’s great to hear, especially about supporting documentation. I also found on their website some other exciting raw materials that I couldn’t find anywhere else!
I have also made few purchases from MySkinRecipes and have bought a lot of products that I cant buy anywhere else here (unless in bulk). You can also buy in very small amounts so for the more expensive actives etc you can buy a small amount to play with and doesnt cost the earth! With exchange rates depending on where you are you will likely find very reasonable plus once you order before you confirm your shipment they give you a shipping quote and what the final cost (with packing) is so you can change your order at any time before final shipping etc. Everything is well packed and all documentation they email to you once they have shipped so you don’t end up with heaps of paper in the package that you would be paying for in weight! It’s easy to convert their costs which are in Thai BAHT (Just use Google for your basic exchange rate depending on what currency you have where you live). If you email them and ask for a basic shipping quote (not worth buying less than total weight of package 500g) to your country. I highly recommend then anyway. Even with shipping costs to Australia I pay much less than I do for products in my own country (and a lot I cant buy here anyway in small amounts or at all!). Good luck with your formulating
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moomin said:Thanks for all your ‘supporting’ advice! NOT!
Here is where I am at, I wanted to find a natural deodorant, I found a recipe that included milk of magnesia and essential oils, it worked wonderfully for me (no burns! fancy that!) and so I thought I might make something similar as a sellable product, not using milk of mag but using the stuff in it. I’m not a chemist, don’t have a clue about chemicals, hence why I’m on here, but I just didn’t realise that I would be meeting with a group of guffawing henrys, who think it’s hilarious and ridiculous that someone doesn’t understand about chemistry! well sorry I got it wrong, I misunderstood this site for support and help!I think that you will find all the Chemists and other members very helpful and supportive on this forum and tell you how it is. I do have a degree (that included Chemistry, Microbiology, Organic Chemistry etc etc) but that was so many years ago that I sometimes forget the basics and once pointed in the right direction by the wonderful people on this forum I find that I can go back to the formulation in question and fix any issues and make a better product. That is thanks to all the members here who take their valuable time to answer those of us that with less knowledge (especially in the Chemistry Dept). There are so many conditions you need to satisfy to sell products and if you don’t understand the basics of what you are trying to make I suggest you just keep making the products for yourself. Not sure where you plan to sell (or where you are) but maybe look at all the laws/rules, labelling requirements, stability testing etc. 1st as you don’t want to create a product to sell that may cause injuries (which I know you wouldn’t mean to) to others and then get sued *that is a real possibility. I make my own deodorant now (with help and advice from people on this forum) and totally changed what I was doing as it was all wrong and in the end my original formula started to be irritating to my skin. My new deo now stops the odor, is the right pH (very important) and is spray probably like you want to create. However I only make it for my family and wouldn’t dream of making it to sell to others in case it doesn’t suit them for whatever reason (plus it is more expensive than an OTC regular one to make). I think it would be great if Perry did an online course on making deodorants as there seems to be a lot of people out there that want to make their own.
By the way my deo also includes some Essential Oils and I use Polysorbate 20 to solubilize them. If you don’t have a pH meter I suggest you at least get some pH strips of various ranges so you can check what your pH is for your products. You may be surprised what the pH is for your deo and find it isnt what you wanted. I bought Mag Hydroxide (MgOH2) to use in my original and have since ditched that one and will be throwing out the MgOH2 unless I find another use for it. The Spray I make is now around pH 3.8 which my pits love. There are some other threads on thus forum regarding Deo’s so maybe check them out too as you will likely find you may change your concept too.I hope you don’t take offense to my post but sometimes it is good to sit back and take notice of other people’s comments (especially the professionals) as they help you look at what you are making in a better light and pass on their knowledge for free (which is a such a gift). You dont need a Chemistry degree to make products but having some knowledge on how and why something works the way it does is a good thing and will only help you improve your products for the future. Cheers
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Hi @Storm
Sorry I haven’t tried to contact Escentials of Australia before only bought small quantiles of ingredients online. I have asked Trulux questions before and they answered after a few days (so maybe ask them? even if you don’t buy the product there? don’t know). MySkinRecipes has a lot of good info on their site and are helpful but limited English so maybe not best option. Why do you need the trade names?
Also the helpdesk at NDA (Amanda Fox-hill) is brilliant and she maybe able to guide you on some technical support - SHe also has another business (Realize Beauty?) I think she does privately, but you would need to pay for that for Support- anyway worth asking her - depending on what your requirements are I guess. -
I havent used but maybe Polybutene and a nice oil like Avocado and butters like Cocoa BUtter, Mango butter etc - Guess it also depends on what your budget is and quantity you are making. Anyway check out the link may help?
Polybutene — TKB Trading, LLC -
Looking for advice on formulating a natural deodorant — Cosmetic Science Talk (chemistscorner.com) - Niece2K = Maybe look at this discussion on formulation a ‘Natural” deodorant - I too had no idea months ago and after finally understanding the pH importance of controlling odor. The original ones (stick/creams) I made were also grainy using Magnesium Hydroxide. So I changed my plan of attack totally (after talking to people on this forum including Graillotion) and now my ‘pits’ are happy and no odor. I made a spray (not aerosol) in a spray pump bottle and I love it. I generally use in morning and that keeps me going most days (plus I live in a humid climate). It would be nice if people shared their formula’s here but that only seems to happen when people have issues with their formula’s - I dont think I have ever seen a formulation that works - ha! Yes I understand that many do this for a living and want to charge you for their time and work
- anyway I like to work these things out as I only make products for myself and family - but it would still be great if people shared more for home formulators. Cheers -
Interesting - The Skin Cancer Australian Council sunscreen only lists the Active Ingredients (not inactive) and the preservative. I would have thought there would be a full ingredients on the bottle list but there isnt. Maybe they dont need to and dont want to show all the cheap ingredients they use (ie mainly water)? I find it a bit weird as all cosmetic type lotions and creams all have to have a fill list here.
Sunscreens | Therapeutic Goods Administration (TGA)Ingredients on labels
All active ingredients must be declared on the labels of therapeutic sunscreen in Australia.
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Ok thanks for the clarification. Cheers
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Hi not sure what you mean is Hawaiian Noni and Gotu kola one product? (I do use Gotu Kola -I have a glycerin extract in some of my products and love it).
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Yes I had a look but cant buy here and I could only see on Etsy - So doesn’t look like I will be able to use - mind you I’d only want to sample to test anyway. I’m happy with my lotions and potions white and cream as only for myself but I can imagine if you are selling lots of women like pink!
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What is legal in China? The poor people don’t get much say if the Authorities don’t like something.
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Sounds like you have nailed it or close to
I like the sound of adding the Buah Merah Oil (have never used but will look into at some time, not sure I can buy in Australia - I’ll look at my usual suppliers though). Cheers -
Hi I have never bought any but after making a few whipped butters and finding them way to greasy (for my personal preferences), I started making emulsified butters and they arent at all greasy. The actual % of butters are quite low though (I use a mix of Cocoa Butter pellets, Mango Butter with a few different Oils (MCT, Macadamia) with OliveM1000 and Cetearyl Alcohol. Water phase I just use Distilled Water and Glycerine + Chelator. In Cooldown I use whatever Essentials Oils or Fragrance Oils + Preservatives etc depending on what results I want with the product. Thats my basics anyway. Just play around with and see what you think. You can make for around $2 (USD) I reckon for 100g pot.
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Hi everyone that helped me with this formulation. I made my first test batch today and the only issue I had was when I added the Hydrogenated Vegetable Oil (which as I was basically doing a cold process) didn’t want to dissolve I added last as I wasn’t sure I needed this ingredient so probably wasn’t the right move either! - Is there a trick to adding this - needs heat? Anyway I don’t know why I added it as the formulation without it was pretty good. Only made 30g to test so now ready to make a larger batch with what I learnt from my 1st test. I didn’t end up doing the glycols (so a lot more basic than the Clarins one but it only cost me a few dollars to make - Clarins is $50 (AUD) for 15g.
I also added mica and beige premixed iron oxides (which was great as didn’t have to buy a whole lot of different colors to get the color I wanted!), Zinc Oxide +Titanium Dioxide Transparent (Dimethicone coated) to the product which made it a light beige (just what I was after). Note that I am not adding these for any SPF values but if it adds some that’s a bonus. It is really meant to be a face primer so you put on before applying foundation etc. The version I made makes my skin feel smooth and had a matt finish (what I wanted).
Before I make my next batch does anyone have suggestions on what % max I can use for the Titanium Dioxide (above)? I didn’t want to add any more Zinc Oxide as I don’t want that white effect. I was pleasantly surprised how nice the Mica feels too as have never used before as this type of formula new to me.
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Sorry I dont know why you would bother. What’s wrong with a nice shade of lipstick - They come in very nice shades of pink. Agree with Pharma totally. I have lovely (note sarcasm) Irish skin due to genetics and even though I dont like my freckly skin living in Australia in the tropics not much I can do about it except do all I can with Suncream and wearing protective clothing - what I would do to have darker skin - but at some stage you have to accept that this is the way you are and meant to be and be happy with that.
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Pharma said:Comedic and cosmetic… sounds like the same thing to my Swiss German ears . Besides, isn’t it better to be a bad comedic genius than a good comedogenic genius, right?
Honestly though, my answer was meant to be serious, like 100% serious.
If you had to giggle (which is absolutely okay but not mandatory), then it’s due to what’s written between the lines (or you had enough to drink… which means, I’m now going to eat all the Kirsch filled chocolate myself :blush: ).Pharma - I always enjoy reading your thoughtful comments (and yes sometimes funny - Aussies appreciate good humor!) - Speaking of funny if you ever get a chance to see Bill Bailley (he was just here in Cairns and best and funniest show we have ever been to!) do yourself a favor and enjoy a good night out (You may be able to sneak in your Kirsh choccies) - I now feel like some of them to go with my morning expresso!) _ Cheers
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FWIW I think the Chamomile Extract will give your product a nice aroma even if it doesnt work (who can say if it does or doesnt and is sometimes just perception and smell counts a lot for most women).
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I make a rinse-off oil cleanser (I call in Cleansing Shower Oil) but I think has same principles for what you are after (forms an emulsion with water when you use in shower - but my partner uses to wash his face too) . It is basically 10% Polysorbate 85 or 80 and 8%+ CCG. (I haven’t used Polysorbate 20 personally but Ketchito would know much more than me for sure) with your Carrier Oils and I add essentials oils or fragrance Oils for the smell (but you can leave out). The latest one I have made has the following which I really like 🙂
Polysorbate 85 10% +2% try less first and see what rinse off is like
CCG Solubilizer - INCI Caprylic, Capric Glucoside; Caprylyl/Capryl Glucoside 8%
Caprylic/capric triglyceride 70%+
Isopropyl Myristate 8%+
Essential Oils to total 1% (Lime, Lavender, Litsea, Mandarin) - Skip this if you don’t want any aroma etc
Anyway the above rinses off well and leaves skin smooth and clean and not stripped.
Cheers -
Hi Silvia - I plan making some products soon (over the next month or so) with different forms of Vit C and for Serums and creams/lotions so will see how I go and report any issues that I find - I only plan doing small amounts and only for myself to begin with ( I wont be keeping any at 40 C though ) - and I planned to use Ferulic Acid in some. I will now do a tests with and without it and see. In meantime if you have results without Ferulic would be good to know too. Wishing you all the best and I think this is a great forum to learn from each other. I wish I had more to offer and as time goes on hopefully I will. Cheers
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What’s in hair conditioner, and how does it work? | Lab Muffin Beauty Science
Maybe check out Lab Muffin blog and Super Simple Creamy Hair Conditioner: 3 Ways - Humblebee & Me (humblebeeandme.com) to get some simple ideas especillay if just home formulating. I have fine hair that doesnt tangle so it will also depend on your hairtype you are catering for 🙂 Hair: Types and care instructions (medicalnewstoday.com) I would start with the least ingredients and but small quantities if just starting out until you ae familiar with the ingredients and what works best for you - Once you have a formula you like then buy ingredients in larger sizes - Dont get carried away to begin with as you will find you have a lot of waste - work out what size bottles etc you want to make and just make a small batch at a time until you perfect your formula. Cheers -
Hi Glodie is it a leave in conditioner or wash out you are wanting to make? Agree with Perry (who knows far more about hair than I ever would!). I would make a simple formulation for starters using the least ingredients you can if cost is an issue and see how you go if you havent made before - Are you just making for yourself or to sell? BTMS-25 and 50 like a higher temperature to melt so be aware of that if you havent used before. (also grinding it to a powder before use makes it melt easier).
If cost is an issue I would do something simple to start like this so it wont cost much 🙂 You dont have to use both oils below - whatever is cheaper for youSimple
Hair ConditionerFormula Heated water phase Distilled water 81.25% Glycerine 3.00% Heated oil phase Powdered BTMS-25 (grind your pellets) 4.00% Coconut Oil 4.00% Sunflower 4.00% Cool down phase Preservative (euxyl PE9010) 1.00% Fragrance or essential oil of choice (like Rosemary) - Or
increase to max safe limit and reduce Water0.75% Panthenol powder (vitamin B5) Or omit at this stage and have 2%
more water2.00% Total 100.00% -
Hi there I have never made but maybe check out some supplier sites for formulations to give you some more ideas like Aussie Soap Supplies: Solid Shampoo Bar with Argan Oil Tutorial (aussiesoapsupplies.com.au) - this is one but they have a few formulations.
Also Humblebee&me has a number of different Shampoo Bars that may be useful to look at her formulations and video’s 🙂 How to Make Shampoo - Humblebee & Me (humblebeeandme.com).
Also Making Cosmetic USA have some formulations and they have PDF’s you can download too Homemade Shampoo Formulas | Make Your Own DIY Shampoo with Recipes | MakingCosmetics
And How to make a cocoa shampoo bar - Formula BotanicaAll the above are more for the home formulator. Have fun researching. Cheers