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Consider adding 1,3 Propanediol and pentylene glycol to your arsenal. Both can be bio-based….supplier dependent.

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There is a concept in formulating, where every ingredient either helps with, or hinders the overall formula’s preservation profile. Very few ingredients would be considered completely neutral in that regard.

However, all the ones you mentioned should fall into the positive category. The only one I do not use is PG, for two reasons. It is usually petrol based, and with its short carbon chain, it is not nearly as boosting as something like pentylene glycol. I prefer my glycols to work in the preservation segment more so than in the humectant side, albeit they typically do both. (Prowess of each…determined by carbon chain length.)

I have grown to appreciate the skin after-feel of sodium lactate, and kinda love everything ‘lactic’. Granted you lose a lot of polymeric options….but I have been loving products made with Na Lactate and Hydrovance (Hydroxyethyl Urea). I still toss a kiss of glycerin into this soup….gotta keep those aquaporins alive and kicking.

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Lume: And you can get there many ways….just get there. ????

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I should mention….I have never used Na-PCA in a full blown formula with supporting humectants and barrier function. I like for ingredients to impress me neat first. According to Mr Deckner, he likes it paired with glycerin….hehehe….which has only made me MORE skeptical….hmmmmn. (Doesn’t everything work as a good humectant….when paired with glycerin? ???? )

As one of my favorite comedians on this site once said…maybe George was just filling his quota of verbiage on UL Prospector? ????

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165…all the way.

I like to use a 1 part to 10 of an anionic, to make it ‘bulletproof’. This can be GSC, SSG, or what I have been using lately… Potassium Cetyl Phosphate.

As far as the polymeric. I was always taught that fundamentally…a water gelling agent always enhanced the stability of the emulsion….gums or polymerics. Obviously…. if the addition can enhance the haptics….then even better. As far as what feels good…to me… Zen the worst… Aristoflex AVC the best. You can play around with blending AVC with EMT 10 or carbomer….70% AVC and 30 of the latter…I think you’ll find something you’ll like. I like to keep the overall polymeric around .7% to .8%….as I seek just a gel undertone.

If you really want to dress it up…add some pentylene glycol….and thank me later (1.5 to 2%) Not only will your preservation system thank you….but it makes water feel wetter….and combined with fast breaking AVC….you are on your way to something. 🙂

Aloha!

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Guessing 1% line is just after the Niacinamide….hence the peptides is probably similar to the contents of a sneeze. 🙂 So everything above the 1% line is dirt cheap. Easy!

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Sodium stearate….and I concur….they left a word out before castor oil… A word like ‘hydrogenated’ cus they wanted to sound natural. ????

I would be a little suspect on the preservation system….as it appears only their deo active is used in that double duty. Very much guessing….there has been some omissions.

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I was under the impression that the acetate form of E did very little in the area of oil preservation, and was used for purported skin benefit? Am I misguided? I thought you needed MT E for oil preservation.

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I can only bask in the glow of Matt’s intellect. But I can often times see the elephant in the room. ???? ????

Follow Matt’s advice, but consider this….can you sub the butter with Murumuru? It is almost devoid to stearic acid…which is in a nutshell….the issue. 🙂

Give it a try.

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Oh no! I don’t even know where to start. ????

First….. the carrier oil market is almost as saturated with fake oils…as the essential oil market. The company you presented…is the best of the best…at selling fake oils. (You realize this once you start buying the real version.) The basic first rule of cosmetics is….we buy from reputable sellers….not Amazon, ebay (all though there are a handful of reputable ones sprinkled in there), and ETSY.

As there is not an aloe oil….they have just taken a uber cheap oil….and infused some part/type of aloe. Earlier….when I said….I had never heard of Aloe oil….that was said totally tongue in cheek.

I don’t have time to ‘fix’ this….but start with some reputable oil sellers….so you at least are not selling fake products. Here is a brief list of people that will not intentionally sell you fake oils:

Simply Ingredients

Jedwards

New Directions Aromatics

Making Cosmetics

Lotioncrafters

Formulators Sample shop.

There are more….but this should get you headed in the right direction. Of course as you start buying the real oils….the price will be higher than the fakes! I did create the list in order of respect (maybe 2 and 3 can flip flop). Valerie at Simply Ingredients is the best of the best….just has limited variety.

Good Luck.

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What country are you in?

Here are two repackers in the US that carry bio based pentylene glycol:

Pentylene Glycol BIO 1460 | MakingCosmetics

Pentylene Glycol (formulatorsampleshop.com)

makingcosmetics.com

Pentylene Glycol BIO 1460 | MakingCosmetics

Hydrolite 5 green, natural pentylene glycol

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@jemolian I had not seen that site before…but maybe I’ll check it out….since I am making up the contest…as I go.

The formula will be broken into segments similar to this:

humectants

emulsifiers

natural lipids

emollients

claim ingredients

water gelling agents….etc…etc…

Their choices will be limited to ingredients I have on hand (a VAST array) , and the entire group will get to comment for 24 hours on each segment….but only 10 members will actually get to vote. The group gets to try and influence the panel…with their arguments for ingredient selection. Once they have completed all segments…..I will make the formula….and send it off to a celebrity (cosmetic) panel for judging. Wish me luck. ????

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Thank you Dr Geis….so would something like Liquid Germall Plus (INCI Diazolidinyl Urea (and) Iodopropynyl Butylcarbamate (and) Propylene Glycol fit the bill….as is has a couple of other things along for the ride….(safe to breath). ?

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???? As a reader of old forums…NONE of the old links work (pre-remodel)…nothing to do with expiration, everything to do with the remodel. ????

I assume……you are referring to David Steinberg’s book?

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Ever since the forum got the remodel….none of the old links work anymore. @Microformulation any chance you still have this link handy?

I would enjoy the read.

Aloha.

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Hah…never thought of that…. ????

But OMG…I would have never guessed this result…. #2…Yes…but number 1????? (Used ‘Body Lotion’ for search criteria.)

I notice this is just sales from the last month…..so maybe #1…has an incredible Black Friday special?

Thank You.

Hehehe….I’ll report back in a month….how ‘herding cats’ goes. ???????? I’ll select 10 of them….break the formula into pieces…..and let them select the ingredients I have from each category….like barrier, emulsifier, water gelling agent, emollients, lipids, preservatives (with supervision) chelates, and one claim ingredient. Fortunately….I have hundreds….hehehe.

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Laughing my Arsh off… Marie had now taken their (FB) course, and is worse than ever! And apparently, was not willing to pay for it….so has to work them off, by trying to sell them in the middle of all her videos. ???? She went from bad….to intolerable.

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Never made a cold process emulsion in my life. ???? I love the melty things too much. ????

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Was there supposed to be some links? None appeared.

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@chemicalmatt one more question…as this is a plant forum…right? ????

We often spend big bucks on potting soils that contains mycorrhiza, and we also know that not all soil bacteria are bad! So typically, the use rate floats around 2-3% but also up to 12.5% of the 3% H2O2 in H2O. At this rate…are we damaging these friendly’s….or is the dilution sufficient that we would just irritate them at best? At what rate of H2O2 inclusion…are we not going to damage our friendlies?

I have seen a plant blogger (kinda like a mommy blogger in cosmetics)…which I would consider just one step above normal plant blogger people….but does not have a Masters or PhD. She distinguished pharmaceutical grade H2O2 with food grade H2O2, and said that many times the Pharma grade is co-stabilized with silver!? Do you concur? And where the heck….does one buy food grade H2O2?

Aloha.

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@chemicalmatt Hey Matt….I’m gonna take this one WAY off course. I am a plant guru….and H2O2 is often used in plant supplementation. There is however a concern among the educated….of what is being used as stabilizers in store bought H2O2 (and the benefit…or mainly lack there of…for plants). Question….are there sources available (to the common man) that are devoid of stabilizers (talking hopefully the 3% dilution….but able to do the maths….if not) that one could use on plants….and still sleep well at night?

Aloha

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Aloha….I also have a perennial bout of toe-nail fungus. I have NO INTENTION of making a product to sell or distribute….just feel like I should be able to create something at home.

4 minutes into my research…I have come across undecylenic acid….twice….at rates of 10-25%. If you were to concoct something at home…what would be your ‘go to’ ingredient/s?

What about from a commercial OTC product…have you found one to work better than the others? I am also open to the idea of just buying something….as I have ZERO interest in this type of product….other than getting rid of my own concern.

Aloha…..hehehe…yup wear slides 365…. so toes are always on display.

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@DRBOB@VERDIENT.BIZ The marketing on this form of E glistened nicely off the shiny brochure. I was a little bit dazzled. ????

They say the Molecular Weight is 554.65.

How does this so easily slip through the skin at this size, when other things of this size struggle to wiggle through the cracks? ????

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Amen!

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May I make a suggestion….just that….nothing more.

Looks like this is your first foray into a segment that has many pitfalls and traps.

Consider hiring a qualified cosmetic chemist to walk you through this process. (Note….there are just as many fake formulators….as essential oils and carrier oils!!!!!!) Not only will they have likely made many similar formulas…hence the effort (cost) to make yours will be minimal. But they will generally also direct you in areas of suppliers, packaging, marketing etc.

In the future, you can take what you learned from the professional…and apply it to your own additional ventures…but at least you’ll be pointed in the right direction.

There is a tab on this site….that will put you into contact with these vetted pro’s. (I am not one of them….so I am not looking for a job. ???? )

I think the best investment you can make.

Good luck.