[fareloz]

MarkBroussard said:

@toketsu

Baking Soda in water will form Carbonic Acid that in water will revert to Carbon Dioxide and Water … hence all the gas produced when using Sodium Bicarbonate.  You don’t have that issue with Sodium Hydroxide.

But, if this is DIY for your personal use, Baking Soda is fine.  But, you would not want to use it in a product for commerce. 

It looks like you already knew the answer, but weren’t completely certain.  

Thank you for the input! Yes, I tried to understand myself the reasons, but I wanted to have a confirmation from someone who is from the field. Thanks a lot!

[fareloz]

ketchito said:

@toketsu Sodium bicarbonate (baking soda) is a weaker base than Sodium hydroxide, so that is one reason. Also, Sodium hydroxide is cheaper (although in some countries you need to ask for a permit and declare your annual consumption, since it’s also used to make Breaking bad kind of drugs). You mentioned the CO2 release and that carries an aereation issue (especially in emulsions).  

Thank you! I didn’t know about the cost… 
If baking soda is a weaker base does it mean it doesn’t fully react or something? 

[fareloz]

Abdullah said:

Do as Dr catherine said.

Dr Catherine Pratt said:

Use NaOH and make up a dilution before you add drops for pH adjustment 

Thank you both for your input, but can you elaborate a bit more? NoOH of cosmetic grade is not easily available in DIG quantity.. Could you tell why better to use it instead of baking soda? 

[fareloz]

Dr Catherine Pratt said:

Use NaOH and make up a dilution before you add drops for pH adjustment 

That’s not what I asked 

[fareloz]

For pH adjustment 

[fareloz]

GeorgeBenson, usually extracts  are preserved with some preservative, so actual preservative could be hidden behind extracts names. Many brands hide preservation in this way to be more “green” and “clean”. Together with high glycerin and diol content it could give a decent preservation. I hope they had a good stability testing

[fareloz]

zetein said:

Calamine lotions are not preserved.

If I understand correctly, you mean pink two-phase spot drying lotions, like Mario Badescu one. If so, their liquid is a pure alcohol.

[fareloz]

From the user perspective, I think it is Alkyl Acrylate Crosspolymer. I noticed that gels with film-formers like this (or Carbomer in case of my CeraVe cleanser) leave a tiniest film on the skin and it feels less drying.

[fareloz]

But I would expect the same ratio of ingredients, e.g. 1 to 4 or something like that, but the ration is different…

[fareloz]

The question is: do you really want to add anti-irritant? It seems like you want to mix unmixable things. It’s like shampoo and conditioner in one bottle canceling each other. Maybe wiser would be to have 2 different products: one AHA (I guess it is a peeling) product and one soothing afterward?

[fareloz]

ariepfadli said:

I used allantoin and sprinkle zinc PCA

I checked my supplier, Zinc PCA requires 4.0-6.0 pH otherwise side effects will happen

[fareloz]

I also use Allantoin. If you have good grade of it, it dissolves with no issues and mostly no heating. I usually add 0.5% of water content in my product.

[fareloz]

Squinny said:

For the dumb people like me what is LAA?  Assume L-Ascorbic Acid? If so are you just using L-Ascorbic acid powder? I have made myself a very basic 10% Vitamin C serum with Distilled Water, L-Ascorbic Acid Fine Powder 10%, Ferulic Acid 0.8%, Glycerin, Pentylene Glycol, Xanthan Gum Clear + another preservative and have in an Amber dropper bottle wrapped in foil - This was just a test for myself and after close to 3 months it is still the same color it was when I made it. I kept in fridge at 12 degrees for first month but since then is at room temp (my room temp is around 25 to 26 degrees). I intend playing around with the formula so always interested in what other people are doing on this forum and continuing to learn. Note that mine is for my own use only and not to sell. Cheers

Yes, LAA is L-Ascorbic Acid.
Yes, L-Ascorbic acid is used as a powder.
The fact that your serum is still clear might not mean LAA is still non-oxidized. I heard (but I don’t claim it and would like to know if it is true) that brown color in serum is a reaction of LAA oxidation with aminoacids (the same way as fake tan reacts in skin). So if you have plain mix of LAA and Water you won’t see a color? Also, I’ve seen that there are several steps of degradation, so some products of degradation might not have a color? 

Also, the lower pH the more stable the acid. I don’t see any adjusters in your formula, so I assume it is very low ith 10% of LAA.

[fareloz]

Pharma said:

Do you have any source for that claim? Sodium and lactate are both electrolytes… Anyway, it does degrade faster in presence of certain metal cations (mostly ‘redox active’ heavy metals).

You are right, I mean metal ions. I’ve never seen a formulation with LAA and Sodium salts together, so I assumed Sodium is also speeds-up the degradation.

[fareloz]

DeedeeUkulele said:

Whenever I add ferulic acid to my anhydrous L-ascorbic acid serum, it quickly turns yellow. I know it’s not the LAA because the solution containing LAA alone is still completely clear after a month.

Serum 1 - Still clear after 30 days
15% LAA
85% propanediol

Serum 2 - Yellow in 5 days
15% LAA
1% ferulic acid
5% Sodium lactate
79% propanediol
* Heated to 50C to dissolve the ferulic acid

The difference between those 2 formulas is not only ferulic acid, but also Sodium lactate. Try to take it out and see what happens. LAA quickly degrades in presence of electrolytes (which is Sodium, right?), although I am not sure if it applies in waterless solutions.

[fareloz]

There is a study called “Mixed solvency approach”, it describes synergy between solvents. There is SA used as a model poorly soluble ingredient. So I guess you are following their method - combine sodium citrate, propylene glycol and polysorbate to get synergy of solvents.

For commenters above: sodium citrate is a hydrotrope used in many products to dissolve SA (or better to prevent recrystallization), it is not used as a chelator here (reference: Application of Sodium Citrate As Hydrotropic Agent In Spectrophotometric Analysis of Salicylic Acid)

[fareloz]

According to “Solubility prediction of salicylic acid in water-ethanol-propylene glycol mixtures using the Jouyban-Acree model” study, solution of 50%/50% water/PG can dissolve 2% SA. So it is more 1:25 ratio. But it for pure SA with low pH.

[fareloz]

Salicylic acid will precipitate with time because 20% of PG is not enough to keep it soluble. Although since you had raised the pH to 3.5 only around  22% of SA are not neutralized, so it can potentially be enough .

[fareloz]

If I am not mistaken the next formula is correct for the ratio:
138.121g of SA + 84.007 of baking soda = 160.11 Sodium Salicylate + other products of the reaction.

I don’t think there is much profit in using sodium citrate if you gonna neutralize SA.

Solubility in glycols is IMHO quite high, it low in water+glycol mixture. According to research called “Solubility prediction of salicylic acid in water-ethanol-propylene glycol mixtures using the Jouyban-Acree model” you need a 50%50% mixture of water+propylene glycol to get 2% solubility of SA 

[fareloz]

It is more complex question then just dissolve oils.
Since the mixture will be apply to shoes you need to test if it leaves marks, ruins the color of fabric, how good it masks odor, how quickly it evaporates etc.
All of the mentioned ingredients may dissolve oils, but my choice would be alcohol since it is a good solvent for essential oils (used in perfumes), evaporates quickly without leaving stains and has sanitizer properties (which is good for shoes since some of the smell comes from bacterias). Cons: could wash off some of the color from fabric, but I think this spray will be used in small quantities.
Other mentioned ingredients don’t have these properties. Polysorbates will leave oily stains. Witch hazel is basically an alcohol. 

[fareloz]

chemicalmatt said:

You need to put octocrylene back into that formula if you want to sell in the USA. That is the indicated stabilizer for avobenzone that is also an approved sunscreen. 

+1 to this statement. Avobenzone is quite unstable and octocrylene is a must to partially stabilize it.

lesmith1018 said:
Hi, 
does anyone have some suggestions for low cost SPF boosters for sunscreen?
thanks!

Not sure what you mean by “boosters”, but I assume you mean stabilization of filters. There is quite good research called “The photochemistry and photostabilization potential of plant extracts on sunscreen absorbers” which shows stability improvements of the sunscreen when some plant extracts are added (e.g. green tea). Check it out and see if it suits your formula.

[fareloz]

mikeylamar said:

That’s very interesting, I didn’t realise that lowering the water content and using glycerin will increase stability. So I assume that vitamin c retains all of its stability in glycols then. 

Check The Ordinary 23% ascorbic acid in propanediol. Just two ingredients, no water - completely stable. Although not comfortable to use - itchy, shiny, grindy.

[fareloz]

MarkBroussard said:

@mikeylamar

 add in 20% Ethoxydiglycol or Propanediol … it will feels much more pleasant on the face.

Cafe33 said:

I am using 10% Propylene Glycol and 20% Ethoxydiglycol 

Correct me If I am wrong, but in Europe we have 2.6% limitation for Ethoxydiglycol in leave-on products

[fareloz]

Disclaimer: I am not a chemist, just DIY enthusiast.

drjayseesunish said:

Preservative? 

Hi! Yes, you should have a broad-spectrum preservative in products which contain (or will be interacting with) water, because water is a source of life and a good ground for bacteria and mold.

drjayseesunish said:

Why we need to preservative because these all are chemicals?

Even more - everything in our life is chemicals. Why? Because bacteria and mold are so stubborn, so they can live and growth in almost any cosmetic product.

drjayseesunish said:

Is phenoxyethanol at 1%  good?

Again, I am not a chemist, but I think just phenoxyethanol is not enough, since most of commercial products tend to not use it solely. Also, preservative choice depends on many factors - how long shelf life should be? should it be “organic” or “natural”? What is pH of your product? etc.
  

[fareloz]

Some sellers say that betaine helps to dissolve allantoin