OldPerry
Forum Replies Created
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@ifamuj - It depends on the formula but yes sometimes. But in some systems it was used in combination with parabens.
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Blue offsets yellow to make it more white.
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I saw it pointed out about this article that…
1. FDA recommendations on hand sanitizers during pandemic is based on the ability to get it made quickly. Ethanol can be produced much more quickly than BKC.
2. Also, BKC resistance is a problem so formulating with it has to be done properly. Alcohol resistance isn’t a thing because organisms cant proliferate in alcohol.
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SLS will create a better foam than SLES so you might want to try that.
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Sometimes you can off-set a yellow color with a little Violet #2
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You’ll need to make significant changes to this formula if you want it to work.
Start with a formula that only has these things. The other things shouldn’t be put into shampoos.
waterSodium Laureth SulfateDisodium laureth solfosuccinateCocamidopropyl betaineCoconut diethanolamideFragrancePreservative -
@amitvedakar - if you want to see the replay right afterwards, you’ll need to register.
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@chemicalmatt - great example! Although VOC rules made hairsprays pretty bad compared to the ones from the late 1990’s
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@emma1985 - I suppose that depends on how you would define “anti-aging”. But for wrinkle fighting, I’d agree.
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The biggest problem is this, you are making a shampoo. The purpose of a shampoo is to remove things from the hair. Anything in the formula that is not helping to remove things from the hair is leading to a worse performing shampoo. So…
Step 1 - Remove everything in your formula that isn’t necessary for CLEANING the hair or stabilizing the formula. Also, use Deionized water instead of hydrosols. This would include:
Rosemary hydrosol
Frankincense hydrosolGlycerin
Sodium PCA
Oil
Hydrolyzed milk protein
Hydrolyzed soya protein
Hydrolyzed rice protein
Glycol stearate
Glycol distearate
PQ-10Step 2 - Adjust the pH of the formula to the proper level which should be pH=5 (or less)Geogard ECT is made up of organic acids which do not work as preservatives unless the formula has a pH of around 5.0. At pH 6.0 your product is not preserved.
Step 3 - Test the formulaIf this is stable, then you can add small amounts of the non-functional, claims ingredients like protein & hydrosols. And you can add in PQ-10 for a little conditioning & Glycol stearate for a pearlizing effect.
You have to decide what you are making. Do you want to make a product that works, or do you want to have a list of natural ingredients that are blended together but don’t actually clean the hair?
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@emma1985 - good one. Yeah, I don’t know when new ones were approved either. Of course, these can’t be used in the US so hasn’t had much impact here.
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There’s no easy answer to this since only you can decide what you mean by “actually worthy to use.” What characteristics make a product worth using?
For the general consumer, you can’t really do better than Olay Regenerist products in terms of performance. P&G spends the most money on R&D and consumer testing so the products (on a blinded basis) are really the gold standard.
But if the packaging of some product better appeals to you, or the fragrance or the story or the claims or the price is most important, then there are lots of other choices.
In reality, if you are most concerned with product performance, buy a product from P&G, Unilever, L’Oreal or one of the other big companies. They will be the most safe, most effective and typically best priced option.
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Extracts are what we in the business call “claims ingredients.” They are put in a formula so marketing has something to talk about. They don’t actually have any impact on the performance of the product, except sometimes they make the main functional ingredient less effective.
Bottom line - extracts in cleansing products are simply washed down the drain.
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@crillz - sorry! We have a worldwide audience so it’s hard to get a time that works for everyone. But be sure to sign up and catch the recording.
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@MarkBroussard - I agree with that.
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Glycerin is the standard humectant that all others are compared to. On a cost basis, it works the best. Someone selling Sodium PCA or a product with it in it will undoubtedly give reasons why PCA is better. I’d be skeptical.
Humectants in leave-on products are helpful for moisturizing hair and keeping it more flexible. They are a waste of an ingredient in a rinse-off product since they simply end up down the drain.
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It’s still difficult to understand exactly what you are asking, however it seems like you are saying that the product performs differently at the beginning of use than at the end.
If that is the case I can imagine two potential causes.
1. The polymer is chemically breaking down over time. This could be the result of chemical reaction, environmental exposure, or microbial contamination. I don’t believe this is likely but that would explain the difference in performance.
2. The polymer was not properly mixed at the beginning so more of it was at the top of the product than at the bottom. When the consumer scoops off the top layer of product, they eventually remove all the polymer so there is none left at the end. More thorough mixing might solve that problem.
Some other reason. Without knowing all the ingredients in the formula or what you mean by “fiber effect” I can’t say much else.
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Ah, that’s your problem. Using immersion blenders & a kitchen aid is not the right type of mixer for systems that are made up of a high level of surfactants. You need slower mixer which does not draw in a large amount of air.
What is happening is you are whipping so much air into your system that the bubbles are tiny and compact such that you can’t easily see them. If you looked at a sample under a microscope you would likely see air bubbles throughout the sample.
Over time, in the jar, air bubbles combine (coalesce) which forms larger bubbles to the point where you’re able to see them.
Solution - don’t use an immersion blender or kitchen aid to mix your ingredients. Use a center stir mixer, keep the mixing paddle below the surface of the liquid and keep the mixing speed slow.
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See this discussion.
https://chemistscorner.com/cosmeticsciencetalk/discussion/comment/51443#Comment_51443Basically, you have too many ingredients.
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Are there air bubbles in it when you are mixing the ingredients together? What is your mixer setup?
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You’ll need to be more clear with your question. What exactly are you asking?
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Soap is a surfactant so they do have surfactants in the product (or it won’t work).
Could you provide the ingredient list?
What makes something “whipped”? Is it just the inclusion of air? -
No, I have not used the software. I have used Design of Experiment software for formulating which has similar aims. The idea is that you can plug in some information about ingredients and the computer will spit out an appropriate formula. It was never too helpful.
The biggest problem with this approach to formulating is that there is not a simple connection between a measured variable and consumer preference / acceptability.
For example, how could you answer the question “what should the viscosity of a shampoo be?” Some people might want a thick formula, others want a thinner formula. There is no numerically optimal level.
The same is with things like coefficient of friction. While you can get a number measurement in the lab, there is no good way to correlate it with consumer preference. Some consumers will think a formula is too greasy, others will think the same formula is not slippery enough.
And to complicate things more, there is no way to correlate a lab measurement with the performance of an ingredient over days or weeks. How would a consumer know whether their condition is improved because of a treatment or it just improved because of time.
Until you can get a numerical lab measurement that predicts consumer preference & performance, software algorithms like these won’t be much help in formulating.
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Welcome to the forum!
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It’s only a guess but what I imagine is happening is that the particles of your emulsion are coalescing when the mixture is cooled and that results in the chunky texture.
You’ve listed your formula but you haven’t listed your manufacturing procedure. Unless you are initially making very tiny particles, your emulsion will be prone to this kind of destabilization. Additionally, I don’t know what all your acronyms are but I don’t see a neutralizing agent in your formula. So, if you don’t neutralize the carbomer, you won’t get the suspending effect from it.