[ngarayeva001]

@EVchem, I would appreciate if you share some materials on bisabolol. I am usually sceptical but bisabolol sounds promising. I read about it in some dermatology book which I have been looking for since yesterday but can’t find.

[ngarayeva001]

I am not an expert in colour cosmetics and most of my attempts are failures. A question based on my mistakes: are your pigments coated with anything to make them hydrophobic (methicone)?

[ngarayeva001]

I have only been at one - Incosmetics Global and it’s very supplier heavy as you said. But the great thing about it is that you see trends and notice new/ smaller suppliers. Smaller suppliers are more friendly and some of them are willing to sell small quantities. This alone makes it worth it for me.

[ngarayeva001]

Oils don’t do much in general. When I look at a new oil all I care about is the fatty acid profile (C=C  bonds or no C=C bonds). And in most cases, I just end up using esters anyway. I tried many fancy oils when I started formulating. And with time I got rid of all of them and the only vegetable oils I own now are shea butter, jojoba oil (which is actually a wax) and almond oil because where I live it’s much cheaper than mineral oil (which is ridiculous) and I use it in products that I use quickly and in large amounts such as emulsified body scrubs.

Speaking of castor oil, the only reason to have it (that I see for myself) is to use it in lip products if you make them. It performs well in lip balms and lipsticks. I don’t know why is that (maybe viscosity), but I figure it out in an experimental way and then noticed that it’s used widely in the industry for this purpose. 

[ngarayeva001]

It’s not an extract but I read in some dermatology book that alpha-bisabolol shows promising results when it comes to anti-irritation. I can’t recall which book it was but they induced inflammation using 24 hours SLS patch and then compared the speed of healing using the vehicle with and without bisabolol (at different %). Looks like it worked at just 0.15% pretty well. By works, I mean that redness got better several hours faster where bisabolol was applied. At least placebo controlled.

[ngarayeva001]

Nothing “cleans” clogged pores but physical extractions that are done mechanically or with the assistance of ultrasound or vacuum. Comedones are prevented or reduced by the use of salicylic acid and other ingredients that control sebum production such as retinoids, niacinamide, and maybe Zinc PCA. Oils are emollients and don’t have any other benefits.

[ngarayeva001]

I used rather high amounts of both (3-5%) in formulations with Aristoflex AVC, Sepinov EMT 10 and Pemulen Ez4U. No impact on viscosity. Can’t comment on other polymeric emulsifiers but in my experience, Aristoflex is one of the trickiest and if Aristoflex isn’t impacted others wouldn’t be either.

[ngarayeva001]

I guess it’s a matter of amount because I use 0.2% of Disodium EDTA in several formulas with Aristoflex AVC, which is utterly sensitive to electrolytes, but I haven’t noticed any adverse effect. 

Here is an example:

INCI	%
Aqua	85.75%
Disodium EDTA	0.20%
Betaine	2.00%
Butylene Glycol	3.00%
Propanediol	1.00%
Germall Powder	0.20%
Cetearyl Isonononoate	5.00%
Dimethicone 10	1.00%
Tocopherol	0.10%
BHT	0.05%
Pemulen Ez4U	0.20%
Aristoflex AVC	1.30%
Bisabolol	0.20%

There are no other thickeners but Aristoflex and Pemulen and both don’t tolerate salts. I think I should make two identical formula with and without EDTA and compare, but my point is that even if it has an effect it’s minor because it’s quite a bouncy and fluffy gel even with 0.2% of EDTA. 

[ngarayeva001]

The majority of acrylic acid derived polymers don’t tolerate electrolytes. Some, like Zen, do better than others but they all lose viscosity. Sodium Lactate at 2% would turn Zen into liquid asl well. Stick to glycols for humectants. Sodium Lactate, Sodium PCA, Magnesium Ascorbyl Phosphate, Magnesium Sulfate, NaCl, Zinc PCA is not a full list of ingredients that cause loss of viscosity.

[ngarayeva001]

The SDS says it’s Ultrez 30, however it’s always makes sense to write to them and confirm. 

[ngarayeva001]

UK is the best place to be if you are after DIY sizes because everyone delivers (if you are ready to pay shipping costs). 

Here are a couple of great suppliers: https://www.glamourcosmetics.it/it/
they have Pemulen TR-1 (lookup in rheology modifiers)
https://www.makingcosmetics.com/

One of my favorite suppliers available on Amazon as well. But since it’s out of the EU you will have to pay around 30% extra to shipping for VAT and customs fee upon delivery (sometimes Amazon makes more sense although looks more expensive). They have 940, 980 and I believe what they call GelMaker Powder is Ultrez 20, but you need to write to them. 

https://lotioncrafter.com/products/sodium-carbomer-preneutralized-carbomer

It’s not ultrez series but it’s my favorite of all carbomers. It’s preneutralised.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/trulux.com.au/amp/pemulen-ez-4u/

Same story with custom fees but it’s a beautiful material. It is an emulsifier and also creates beautiful gels (2-in-1). It can stabilise significant amount of oil with just 0.2%. It’s the best of all Lubrizol’s products I have ever tried.

[ngarayeva001]

This is carbopol ultrez 30 https://naturallythinking.com/carbomer#
ultrez 10 https://www.thesoapkitchen.co.uk/carbomer-carbul
940
https://www.amazon.co.uk/MakingCosmetics-com-Carbomer-940-1-8oz-50g/dp/B01DEASZK4?ref_=mw_olp_product_details
i understand its expensive because of delivery but I am sharing the suppliers I bought from. There’s also this one but I have not ordered from them https://www.amertek.co.uk/product/carbomer-940-carbopol-940-polymer/

[ngarayeva001]

I found proteins to work in rinse off products by creating film on skin and reducing irritating potential of surfactants. But those are extremely hard to preserve.

[ngarayeva001]

Where are you based? You can get some carbopols from DIY suppliers who are selling small amounts. I know a couple.

[ngarayeva001]

If you see NaCL, magnesium sulfate or zinc sulfate in the list of ingredients it means this is water in oil emulsion. Addition of salts is extremely important, especially when you deal with high internal phase emulsions, because it improves stability. Adding salt in a o/w with acrylic acid (including Zen) stabilisers will have very negative effect on viscosity. Xanthan is more tolerant but I don’t see a reason to add salts to o/w. I have not tried that with anionic emulsions, but all these rheology modifiers are anionic.

[ngarayeva001]

Yes, viscosity that is too high for a sprayer bottle causes the issue. Remove any gums and anything thickening.

[ngarayeva001]

Thank you

[ngarayeva001]

Applying a moisturizer with extremely low amounts of dioxane isn’t an equivalent of smoking a cigarette. Smoking even one cigarette exposes the smoker to a significant amount of harmful components. Meaning 1 cigarette is harmful. Harmful *20 years = very harmful. Non-harmul *20 years is still not harmful.

[ngarayeva001]

@MarkBroussard, you mean trimethylglicine not CAPB right? I read in the supplier’s brochure it has some benefits for hair but decided to keep it for leave on products, because it was pricey..

[ngarayeva001]

There’s a weird tendency nowadays to go back to middle ages. There’s an entire community in the internet who religiously advise against washing hair. All these co-washes, nopoo whatever.. I am all for progress, but progress is when you go from caustic soap to SLES not when you go from SLES to washing hair with shea butter and rinsing with vinegar. 

Regarding repeating and emphasizing that silicones ‘don’t do you right’, you are either not using the right silicones or not using the right amount.

[ngarayeva001]

I raised a discussion on this topic here 2 years ago. Members who work in the industry shared sufficient number of evidence including a couple of research papers that suggest that there’s no such thing as good EO. They all are toxic and bad for the skin. Their only purpose is to make product smell nice. I agree with @natzam44, fragrance oils although also can cause allergic response at some consumers, at least are less phototoxic and more predictable. I personally don’t add any sort of perfume in any leave in product for my face.

[ngarayeva001]

What do you mean by CBS? You want the majority of your product to be cyclopentasiloxane because it acts like water (evaporates) unlike other silicones that will make product too heavy if too much added. The fact your benchmark is sprayable tells me it’s 80%+ cyclopentasiloxane. I use 5% of Alkyl Benzoate for 0.5% of essential oil, but play with %. You might end up adding less. Use 5% as a benchmark because I am using it in a very similar formula and it helps to achieve high transparency. 

[ngarayeva001]

Perry, please correct me if I’m wrong but I clearly remember reading in some legitimate book (probably it was Harry’s) that although black skin is quite different from caucasian morphologically (more sebaceous glands, different thickness of stratum corneum, some other aspects), black hair are not that different and can be treated just as dry hair. adding all those oils makes no sense. So, polyquats, silicones and a little less of detergent would do the trick. 

[ngarayeva001]

I don’t even know where to start. It’s not only vinegar. Sorry, but toss that formula out and start again. Sometimes there’s a way to advice to tweak something to make it better but in this case it’s easier just to start again.

[ngarayeva001]

Dimethiconol is very solid and almost doesn’t flow. For this reason in most cases it is supplied mixed with cyclopentasiloxane. Essential oils can be mixed into that solution but at a very tiny amount. Basically what is going on with this product, they took ready dimethiconol in cyclo blend, mixed essential oils with a little bit of alkyl benzoate to reduce cloudiness and added to silicones. Alkyl here helps essential oils to blend into silicones. They probably added more pure cyclopentasiloxane because those blends are rather concentrated and thick (that’s why it’s sprayable).