MarkBroussard
Forum Replies Created
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It appears they put limonene is all of their lip products … no surprises there.
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Actually, you’re both wrong about Organic Cosmetics. The problem has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that the ingredients are Certified Organic … The problem has to do with the fact that the company selected ingredients that were inappropriate for use in a lip balm product … known skin irritants, particularly the peppermint (menthol). And, the fact that they did not include a preservative in the product.
Those errors can happen with any cosmetic product. Skin irritants and no preservative … that is the issue at play here. -
You’re getting air trapped in the sample from the homogenizer head. As Student54 said, make a much larger batch, perhaps 1000 grams and make certain your homogenizer head is well below the surface of the liquid.DO NOT use the homogenizer after you add the TEA to activate the Carbomer. Instead, switch to a paddle stirrer. This should help substantially in reducing the trapped bubbles.
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I wonder if the problem is primarily, or exclusively, with their products that contain Peppermint Oil. Peppermint Oil in a lip product is not a very good idea and would cause this kind of problem for many people. And, of course, there is no preservative. There are ECOCert preservatives that they could have used that would not have affected their Organic Certification.
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There’s a product named “Waxelene” that is made by expelling the butters through an extruder while blowing air into the solids in the extruder. This is a patented process, but you might check out the patent to get some ideas.
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Tixogel RCM 1357 from Eckart America if you don’t mind using Silicones.
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The pH scale as applied to aqueous systems does not apply to anhydrous systems.
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Why do you not add a bit of a sulfate-free anionic surfactant and use NaCl + Glutamate to thicken. PEG150 is a mess to work with, imho.
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Agree with BobZ. Right now you have an oil-based formulation. Sodium Lactate is water-soluble, so you would need to add a bit of emulsifier to incorporate it. As BobZ points out, if anything, you would be better off dropping the pH to match the skin’s acid mantle balance. At pH 6.0, I’d leave well enough alone if you are happy with your formulation.
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Yes, the FDA really focused on personal lubricants over the past year, so these are relatively new regulations. Basically, a personal lubricant now has to meet the same criteria as lubricants used on lubricated condoms. So, quite a few products had to be pulled from store shelves until they passed the required testing. As if the government didn’t have more important things to take of.
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Those are the commercial names of the NYX Cosmetics Soft Matte Lip Creams.
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If you’re looking to cetyl alcohol as a thickener, you might also consider Emulsifying Wax: Beeswax, Lecithin (Soy), Copernicia Cerifera (Carnauba) Wax
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It is your legal responsibility to ensure that your product is safe for use by consumers. From a legal liability perspective, it is best if you Preservative Challenge Test any product you bring to market. All it takes is one problem and you’ll burn up $450 dollars in legal fees in an hour and without any evidence that you took the necessary steps to ensure your product was safe for use, well, you’ve got real problems.
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As an alternative, you can use Schuelke & Mayr MikroCount Combi Test kits to determine if you have any microbial contamination problems prior to doing a Preservative Challenge Test.
But, yes, $18 to $20 for a plate count done by a lab is an accurate price.For the Preservative Challenge Test, you’re going to have to use a testing laboratory. -
You have plenty enough preservative in your formulation. Potassium Sorbate & Sodium Benzoate is a classic combination, the level of Phenoxyethanol is fine at 1%.On the microbial testing … Don’t take this the wrong way, but if you don’t even know the passing rate … I would recommend that you use a qualified testing lab. The microbial plate count tests are only about $18 to $20.
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In your formulation, you are using a total of 4.2% gums (Carrageenan, Xanthan, Dehydroxanthan).In taking a look at your reference formula, I would suspect they are using approximately 1% Xanthan Gum and 1% Dehydroxanthan gum, or a total of 2.0% gums.Try your formula using 1% Xanthan and 1% Dehydroxanthan (eliminate the Carrageenan) and see what happens. The Bamboo Extract is a rich source of silica that also has a slip feel similar to silicones … that may be a good addition to your formulation.
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@sesha:
The easiest way to disperse gums is the method you are using … Prehydrate the gums in Glycerin to form a slurry and then drizzle the slurry into water while homogenizing.The flaking has nothing to do with the way you are incorporating the gums, it’s simply because you are using a lot of gum and over time, as it dries, well, you’ve got a lot of gum in the hair. Heating water won’t help with that problem.It sounds like you’ve run into a wall where your desire to use natural products have hit their performance limit, but also have undesirable ancillary effects. So, it’s time for you to decide to incorporate synthetic alternatives to achieve the performance you’re shooting for and eliminate the flaking problem.For those of us who formulate in the Organic/Natural arena, we run into this all the time … clients present us with formulations loaded with Silicones and ask for an all natural alternative with the same performance. It simply is not possible most of the time. -
Agreed!
I generally spend at a minimum 50% of my time doing research prior to making the first prototype of a new formulation and 50% working on the formulation. And, in doing the research I invariably learn something new or find new ingredients that I did not have previous knowledge of that improve the final formulation. And, then after the first prototype, there is invariably more research to be done.A broad question such as the one presented … I think the OP does not have an appreciation of just how many hours of research are required to even begin to answer the question they posted … if it can be done at all.Mark’s first post is the perfect answer that should be cut-and-pasted whenever a question like this appears on the forum. -
It’s substantially more helpful if you list the ingredients with the percentage used in the formulation as opposed to the weight since that is the way we evaluate formulas.As Perry mentioned, you’re missing emulsifiers from your formulation.Also, if you are going to add the EO at a cool down stage, you might want to first mix it with a solubilizer like Poly Suga Mulse D9 from Colonial Chemical.Since you have other oils in your formulation, my recommendation would be for you to add the EO’s along with your other oil components.
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Electron transfer to a high energy orbital
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The comment was not directed at you as you most often provide excellent advice, so please do not interpret it that way.In this particular case, the question posed is so broad and nonspecific that it can be interpreted in different ways … the fact that I did not attempt to offer any advice gives you an idea of my thoughts on the question as presented.Sometimes silence says it all. But, if you are interested in providing some help, better to ask the OP to provide more detail as opposed to suggesting that they use this thing called Google. There’s enough negativity and snide attitudes elsewhere on the internet, I’d hate to see that attitude sneaking its way into this forum.
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A note regarding “annoyed” responses …
No one has to reply to any post on this forum. If you think the questioner has not done their research, then simply don’t reply. No one is forcing anyone to read nor reply to any post. I find it amusing that people waste their time with a snarky reply … better you just not reply at all if you don’t have a positive, helpful response.Personally, I do not think the “Vote” on a post is a useful addition to the forum. It seems to have created an increasingly negative attitude on the forums. -
I’ve used Gluconolacctone (and) Sodium Benzoate on numerous occasions and have had no issues with it at 1.0% to 1.5%. A trick is that you do need to incorporate it into the water phase with no other ingredients under high shear and then heat to 70C. Otherwise, it has a tendency to partially re-crystallize if you incorporate it without heating. You can beef it up with the addition of 0.35% Potassium Sorbate.
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Is your manufacturing facility Organic certified?Organic certification for a product generally requires an on-site audit of the manufacturing facility producing the product and the ingredients used to ensure the product and process meets the requirements for organic certification. The quantity of organic ingredients must be calculated to ensure that the % organic ingredients meets the minimum threshold required by the certifying body.So, if you are manufacturing certified organic products why do you not simply tell your client that you will reveal that information directly to the certifying auditor if you retain IP rights to the formulation and they’re going to have to visit your facility under any circumstances. Unless, you’re formulating for an Organic brand, but the products you are manufacturing for them are not Certified Organic.
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I had a client recently who was based in the EU, so I took some time reviewing the regs. In the EU, for cosmetics, you do indeed have to submit a safety report prepared by a safety assessor. And, your products must be registered. It is quite a bit more stringent that here in NA.