Graillotion
Forum Replies Created
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How long has it been, since the probe on the meter has been replaced?
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dab some of this liquid on a tissue….see it it evaporates…. or leaves an oily residue. At least you can confirm what it is…and then progress.
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If it is water…it would evaporate in short order. Guessing something else (syneresis). Any squalane or silicone oils in the formula?
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Check into a hospital, and you’ll find out!
You’ll actually be hard pressed to find a commercial higher end product…without it. Maybe you do not recognize the names it uses on the inci?
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The course at Volcano (and my boy).
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I absolutely concur with OzGirls comment….on ‘if they can’t get the inci right’….
The INCI has to be the absolute easiest part of putting together a product. If you cannot do the simplest aspect…how in the world…would they EVER get the complicated aspects right????
Not a CHANCE! ☹
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You can only edit for 5 minutes. After that … the edit option disappears.
You can message Perry, and in the past he has removed things I wanted removed.
Aloha.
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I am just adding it to the lipid phase in an O/W emulsion.
I have learned over the years…that certain ingredients prefer to work with certain emulsifiers.
This particular emulsion was M 202 + GSC+GMS+Sucrose Stearate, plus typical builders.
(SS in the water phase, so it is hydrated and ready to work…upon combining.)
Use of fatty alcohols…assumed.
I had…subbed all the steric hindrance aspects over to .5% SeaBalance…in an experiment, but don’t believe this was fundamental in the viscosity loss. I had a similar result a year ago, before SeaBalance was even a twinkle in my eye.
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Good to hear! Hope they turn the corner soon!
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I have spent the last several months studying the cosmetic preservation industry, as I am writing a blurb on it for a beginner group. One thing is clear… Geogard has spent their efforts on hiring creative writers! Other than AMT (parent company of Luecidal products), there is no greater liberties and fantasy written into the marketing, than with this company. Clearly the chemist that work for this company are let no where near the marketing department, nor allowed to proof read the garbage descriptions they produce.
If you take a look at a Euxyl/Ashland products with similar components, you will find much less fantasy, and pH recommendations much closer to reality (though still the limits are higher than I would go).
I am sure Arxada is shooting for some Emmy or Oscar with their creative writing program, but I don’t feel this achievement merits the use of their products.
Aloha.
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I always sub out 2% of the emollient package, to introduce the 2% hydrocarbon. So oil phase ratios stay the same.
Are you saying…this is an odd situation?
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Sorry…sarcasm overload.
The crafters think they are a big fish, so big successful companies like AMT are bringing them very special preservatives, since they are such a big, cash flush market segment. Preservatives so special, that even P&G is unaware of them, and unable to acquire them. ????
I get a little cynical…when I hang with the crafter’s too much. ☹
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AMT = active micro technologies
A company that specializes in bringing elite preservatives of the most natural kind, to up and coming homecrafters. Almost any nice sounding herb/fruit/flower/yogurt…can preserve your emulsion, par excellence. ????
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$$$ sales…hehehe… Only the almighty dollar counts right?
Actually….where I am headed with this….some of the crafters think they are part of an elite group that big business is trying to target with elite natural preservatives. You know… AMT has already conquered P&G and L’Oréal, and Unilever, so homecrafters….as the next big fish are getting the ‘elite’ treatment and products. ????
Define…. ‘Zippo’ … Is that above or below 1%? If below…is it below .5%?
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Here in Hawaii, we make products with ‘Aloha’. ???? ????
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Aloe is a poor humectant, and excellent bug food. It will not emulsify. 🙂
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Have you tried putting the M68 in the water phase? Does wonders for OliveM 1000, and is an acceptable place for most of the Montanovs. Give it a try. 🙂
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Generally that addition of some cetyl alcohol is thought to reduce soaping…not add to it.
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Of course all kinds of cr^p goes on. How about post the inci of a benchmark you are describing…and the group can take a look…and maybe shed some light.
If you add enough of the several inferior (to dimethicone) ingredients, you can usually make some progress. Probably the best place to start…is with an emulsifier that is not prone to soap. I think…if I recall correctly…the Polyglycerol types would be in this category.
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Why would you include B? She is only a formulator not a chemist…and would not qualify for that list???
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Those with a public presence…. can rarely speak the truth or their mind… kinda like a politician. 🙂
That is the beauty of retirement….Dr Phil and I can call out the BS…and have nothing to lose. ????
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Obviously there is a lot of ignorance in the field, but there is also a lot of undefined/underdefined terms in cosmetics. Many times things that assist in making a better emulsion (aka builders) get lumped into the category of ’emulsifiers’ because they do help.
I am writing a blurb for beginners on preservatives….and undefined/under defined terms…is what I am realizing is a major hurdle for them.
One of my greatest disappointments in the broad spectrum of the industry…is the ‘under-defined terms’. I realize there is no one entity “in charge” that could grab the bull by the horns…and make these definitions, but it would be nice. Hehehehe…on a side gripe…..then we could also define what a ‘cosmetic chemist’ was…. not just someone that took an online course. ???? It is so sad to see people call customer service reps at re-packers, and their favorite mommy blogger…a ‘Cosmetic Chemist’. ???? (When in doubt…..’Cosmetic Formulator’ works every time! ???? )
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I like this quote from REAL cosmetic chemist Amanda, from Realize Beauty:
“I’ve noticed quite a lot of formulations come across my desk containing stearic acid with nothing to saponify it! Stearic acid on its own does not act as an emulsifier. It needs to be saponified with a base- sodium hydroxide or triethanolamine in order to hold your oils and water together. On its own it will make the emulsion a little stiffer and buttery but cetearyl alcohol is possibly a better choice for that function. Rule no 1 of formulating: if you don’t know why it’s in there don’t use it . Amanda”
IMHO I think where all this lore stems from, is those without the proper background mistake it for an emulsifer, because they either cannot distinguish a thickener from an emulsifier, or the other angle I would suspect would be….when an untrained eye looks at certain emulsion, and in this example will use a stearic acid based emulsion….they are unable to put all the pieces together. They see the stearic acid, but do the realize the function and quantity of the alkali in the formula, and just assume the stearic acid miraculously went from fatty acid thickener to …. magical emulsifier. As mentioned before…. Ignorance creates an ethereal bliss.
And you have to always remember the Golden Rule of Lore based cosmetics. If it is repeated often enough on the internet…. It must be true!
Sadly I know you will be required to write the wrong answer in your program…but at least you have the cognitive abilities to see through this error, and move on in the future, on the correct path. Good luck in your journey. The correct answers are out there….sometimes you just have to do a little digging. And remember this lesson: Be careful when you blindly follow the ‘masses’…. Sometimes the ‘M’ is silent.
Aloha @Juggsy
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Oh Dr Geis, I believe the most iconic of all golf pics was taken at my local course:
Thank you…I will read tomorrow…after my guests leave.
Aloha @PhilGeis
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@PhilGeis You have mentioned the evaluations/testing in the Annex…. Is this material available for public consuption? I would like to see these charts/evaluations…as I believe it would help me expand my knowledge of potential preservative components.
Aloha.
Golfed the Kona side today….about froze to death…rained the last 12 holes…and chilled my inner core. ???? I’ll stick to my home course at Volcano!