Graillotion
Forum Replies Created
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Please list the pH as well.
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May I make the logical suggestion of…..instead of us guessing….why don’t you list the ingredients.
Otherwise…I’ll go with battery acid. 🙂 How did I do?
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Where to even start. I am not involved with legal ramifications of contract mfg…but wow….this is a (won’t use the word ‘formula’ in this situation) recipe from ‘Ell. I was shocked to see that someone else was making it for them…and can guess why they went out of business. Honestly, this recipe looks like someone watched a few YouTube videos from ‘BumbleBee and You’, and decided they should be in the cosmetic business. I would investigate your liability for being the mfg of a known sub-par product!
There is a plethora of issues you will run into…as you start tweaking the ‘recipe’, that will end up having you reformulate the whole thing, from the ground up. Just something as simple as changing the emulsifier inclusion rate to something reasonable…will throw the viscosity into a whole new realm (as well as changing the haptics). Everything you change…will have down the line ramifications. This is not something you can make a few tweaks…and call it good. This is a ‘do over’, project. I mean look at the basics…there seems to be no goal in making this product (you could not convince me it will do anything…other than leave a scented oily sheen on my skin). Look at the preservation…there are NO hurdles….no glycols, no chelate, worst possible container….no known pH. You are below the minimum use rate on the preservative, in a container that screams….contaminated! You have nothing in the formula to help the preservative.
Please don’t add aloe…is a very poor humectant, and amazing bug food. It appears as though your client is not interested in making the formula functional or of value…but just wants it to hold together?! So I will not go any further…. other than to recommend you find out from your legal professional, what your liability is in a case like this. I suspect you will drop out….once you hear back. 🙂 Aloha.
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Note II: The amount of ’emulsifier’ to oil phase percentage…seems to be out of wack. I thought the mommy blogger rule of thumb was 25% e-wax to oil phase?
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Looks like a knock-off emulsification system of e-wax. As said above…you are lacking a water gelling aspect…some kind of gum or polymeric. This should help a touch.
I would consider mixing the essential oils with 1% triethyl citrate before adding them. This often will help hold them in place better.
As mentioned above…consider strengthening the emulsion with the add of 1/10 of the emulsifier as a anionic (GSC or SSG or PCP).
May I ask what kind of formula (or maybe recipe is a better word) this is? It does not even have a humectant? When I look at that….all I see is emulsified, scented grease?
You did not list any process steps….as process is often one of the most critical aspects…. do you have equipment that provides shear? Stirring from shear to cool down, the whole time? Temps of each phase when combined…etc…etc…
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I stopped reading when the article when it said: “Once you start to DIY, your cabinet quickly fills up with everything from coconut oil to beeswax, citric acid, baking soda and even Shea butter.” My ‘cabinet’ has NONE of those ingredients. 🙂
But to answer… we are all familiar with the concept of stearic acid granules (grainy) gathering to like kind to form grains. Please use the search bar on this site…and you will find hours of reading on the topic. Bottom line…you need to put pieces in place…that keep the like parts from regathering.
The best one I have found to date…is leaving the greasy shea out….all together. There are so many other nicer options.
Good Luck.
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Sounds like you have stumbled across the fact…. savvy experience will often trump book learn’n. ???? (Or at least come close. I’d rather work with someone who has….’been there, done that’…than someone who read about the concept.)
I have no idea where I would be in cosmetics…without the experience. As I did things backwards…. experience first, followed by the education… I like that route better….the education fits the experience, vs trying to retain unknown educational values which you have no idea if they will be relevant or not. Now I KNOW what values need to be retained…and are relevant! 🙂
Never be fooled by a title.
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Did you type ‘syneresis’ into the search bar? This topic has been covered numerous times. 🙂
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Not sure what the purpose was of adding the product with Gluconolactone was? I had assumed it was to serve as your chelate? Why not just make life easy….and add something like: GLDA, aka TSGD aka Tetrasodium Glutamate Diacetate.
Seems like you have created a great deal of hassle….which could easily be eliminated by this simple drop in?
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@PhilGeis I would like to hear your thoughts on the comment:
“After learning from the Institute for Personal Care Science that below 5% water doesn’t require a preservative…”
Thank You.
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You did not say how much you are trying to add?
Here is the mfg comments:
“Solubility Salicylic acid disperses in water up to 0.5%.
Beyond this amount, you are advised to add the salicylic acid in the aqueous phase first and then add
soda little by little until complete dispersion. Formulation with an acid pH to ensure optimum efficacy.”But if your reason for using it is simply sebum control….why not look at an easy to work with ingredient like: Capryloyl Glycine?
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Typically the buffers you are looking at…address pH drifting ‘UP’, not down. I would guess…that you have ingredients that lower the pH, that are not fully in solution/dissolved when you are taking your measurements. You can confirm this….by checking the pH over the next week…and seeing if there is further change.
Try making a version without the Gluconolactone, and see if that does not stop the drift.
Of course…. buy a pH meter. ????
I know you did not ask….but:
Too much Vit E!
Your emulsifier is a weak one….. and you have not surrounded it with any builders! Look at adding a kiss of gum and some fatty alcohol….or I think you will have issues down the road…with shelf life.
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B3 levels much above 4%…is just for bragging rights…and pushing irritation (beyond 10%). The extracts are all for claim. If you want to replace the Glycyrrhiza Glabra (Licorice)Root Extract with Dipotassium Glycyrrhizate, you might get a bit of benefit.
Granted it is hard to sell your potion…if you don’t have some claim ingredients to hang your story on….so add a few in at .1, .01, or .001%…..so you can create the sugar plum fairy land that the customer now demands.
You could also consider adding some NAG to go with you B3… might land a study reader as a customer. ????
Green Tea anything will give you discoloration issues…through the product shelf life…consider removing it now…and thanking me later. 🙂
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(Their Green Tea…is well below the 1% line…so probably in there at .01%.)
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As your skin is pretty forgiving and accommodating, so we use this opportunity to formulate additional hurdles into the formulas. A pH of 4.6 to 4.8, your skin will enjoy….and starts to make the microbes in our potions a little uncomfortable. One more step towards their ultimate demise.
Good Luck.
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I am clueless on hair…but I suspect the ingredients that make human hair feel good….will have the same effect on pets. Why not turn to the world experts on hair…and look at some of the premium P & G products. They are rather straightforward, once you strip away the claim ingredient/s, preservation system, and such.
what make Pantene conditioner feel so good on my hair? - Chemists Corner
chemistscorner.com
what make Pantene conditioner feel so good on my hair? - Chemists Corner
Hi,I am recently learning about cosmetic and pay attention to the product ingredients. I tried so many conditioners but the Pantene stand out the most. this…
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Maybe I am totally missing the point, but when wild animals get greasy….I hear they use this:
(List of formula ingredients, should be on the back of the packaging.)
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????????
Don’t you know the basics of beginner cosmetics? If it is good to eat…it is damn well ….. good for your skin!
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This is a thread from 2018 that a ‘spammer’ brought back to life. 🙂
What do you think….Baking soda time? ???? ????
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Yes, USP 51 is designed to pass…and give your insurance rep the ‘warm fuzzies’. ????
So Dr Geis, @PhilGeis , that was a question that was mulling around in the cotton I have for brains. Do I understand correctly, the USP 51, and the current slate….has no antibiotic resistant Gram - currently? Has there been any talk about adding or replacing a current member, with one of these more tough to kill, bad guys?
Aloha
Did I ever show you this pic…from the Volcano course? ????
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You can….just memba….it is a ‘wash off’ product (Spa treatment for the creatures that live down the pipes?). Here is an example of a product that contains both:
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You have not provided enough information to generate an intelligent response. Please consider listing the formula…especially the emulsifier used, the emulsion builders, and percentages. Equipment used in the process, and time frames can also be critical.
Niacinamide does not have strong history of destabilizing emulsions.
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Maybe read this book. This guy is pretty knowledgeable. ????
Cosmetic Microbiology: 9781138732919: Medicine & Health Science Books @ Amazon.com
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Oh Dr Phil, you’re taking all the fun out of cosmetics. I had been thinking that since Phenoxyethanol is falling out of vogue, I would start to list it as …. Phoxy ethanol…and maybe some would think it was a beauty ingredient. ???? ????
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If we use the re-packer as a data source….we tend to get the first Google search result that a $10.00/hour employee found on the net. It is amazing how deep lore will filter into the system. If we take a little time and go to the mfg…we are more likely to find something like this: