Abdullah
Forum Replies Created
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@ketchito thanks
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@ketchito so what anionic surfactant should we use in acid cleanser?
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@zetein very interesting. I have nothing to say about this but eagerly want to see what the respected teachers have to say about this.
If the skin is positivity charged then why cationic emulsions stick so tightly to skin and resist being washed but anionic emulsions are very easily being removed by water?
Also this data shows same cleaning formulation at pH 4 is milder than pH 7.
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The one with benzoate is better.
The other one also has preservative but they don’t want you to tell you what it is. Maybe because they think you would not like it. -
No foam has no relationship with mildness. If in theory the mildness of both are the same in practice the one with more foam will be milder because you would use less of that.
Skin pH is 4.7. is the pH of those products 4.7?
If you write the ingredients list we would know which one is milder
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What is the preservative?
what is the pH of the one without preservative?
If the pH is below 10 it means they have preservative but they are hiding it so the one one with preservative may have better quality.
If it has high pH then they are both good so purchase the less expensive one
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ariepfadli said:i do my mixing in batch 200kg, daily for up to 2tons only use plastic drum, i just heating oil phase and half of water till boiling with ordinary stove then mixer with high shear mixer, make sure proper emulsification done, then add remain water with slight mixing , then cooling down, whole my mixing equpment cost no more than 3000USD, im produce hair mask, conditioner and perm cream
@ariepfadli
Was the remaining water hot or rome temperature?What is the maximum size of your oil phase?
When and how you add water phase thickener and stabilizer and and what ingredient do you use?
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@Perry thanks
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@syl cationic guar reduces the volume.
Interesting when i was making shampoo with non-ionic surfactant and without conditioner, the foam was bad, the scalp was not cleaning enough and i had to wash it with anionic shampoo now and then but the hair volume was very high. Maybe because it was solubilizing too much oil from hair and that made the hair lighter but i am not sure why.
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@Perry can you name some film formers that increase the volume. Also by what mechanism do they increase the volume?
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@ketchito if cationic guar makes neutral complex with anionic surfactant and deposit this way, does regular guar gum which is also neutral deposit in hair this way and cause buildup?
Does buildup happens because of uneven deposition or because of regular deposition on top of each other?
i have used anionic surfactant in different percentages with other surfactants from 1% anionic up to 12%. In my experience if the anionic surfactant is less than 10% i need to use more shampoo and still the hair doesn’t feel clean or good as high anionic no mater what amount of other surfactants i use.
I will make a sample with half that non-ionic surfactant and see how it works. -
@ariepfadli thanks. Very good explanation for Amodimethicone.
Now i see why when i washed my hair with only surfactants and preservative to find the irritation cause, my hair felt better ????. That may be because the load of Amodimethicone was removed from my hair because i have used it for several months in shampoo.Now how does polymers like guar Hydroxypropyltrimonium Chloride cause buildup in hair? This one doesn’t have hydrophobic side.
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@ketchito thanks
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@Perry thanks ????
Some more questions.1. Does polymers like guar Hydroxypropyltrimonium Chloride need surfactant to be solubilized in water?
2. when shampoo is put on hair and mixed with water, does only cationic polymers deposit on hair or others like xanthan gum and regular guar gum also deposit on hair from this mechanism?
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@ariepfadli thanks i will make a sample without cationic guar and see what happens.
@ketchito in some data they show AOS has more foam than any other surfactant. That is why i wanted to use it. But for me it didn’t work at all.
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@ariepfadli thanks for the information.
when i think deeply i can’t understand why and how this buildup from Shampoo ingredients happens and what ingredients can cause buildup and how.
As i know in theory ingredients remain in hair by two mechanism. Having positive charge and dilution/deposition.
If Amodimethicone or cationic guar or PQ10 attach to hair because of the cationic charge then when all the negative charges from hair surface are saturated with these ingredients and there is no more negative chare, why more of these ingredients get attached to hair and cause buildup?
If they stay in hair by dilution/disposition mechanism and not their positive charge then why other ingredients like xanthan gum or regular guar gum don’t stay on hair and cause buildup from Shampoo?
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In my experience small amounts of thickeners in different phases and different types make a lot of improvement in viscosity and feel than adding too much thickener in one phase or one type.
If you add even 1% wax to your emulsion it increase viscosity dramatically but i don’t like how they feel. Maybe because i have only used beeswax.
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@Syl @ariepfadli thanks.
I i did check preservative and surfactants at currently amount and ratio and the problem was not there. I will check the rose fragrance oil tomorrow and the remaining ingredients after that.I feel too that Amodimethicone had caused buildup.
I did use it at 2.5%(0.75% active Amodimethicone). What percentage du you suggest for it to not cause buildup? Or it is going to cause buildup anyway in any percentage?Does only buildup of Amodimethicone cause irritation or any silicone and polymer?
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@ariepfadli thanks
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Why you want to use oil in shampoo?
If you are selling the product just add 0.00000000001% oil because it doesn’t benefit you from a Shampoo.
If it is for your own use the don’t add it to shampoo. Apply the oil to your hair after shampooing -
@Perry @Pharma @chemicalmatt @PhilGeis any thoughts
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Write the percentage of all ingredients so we know what the problem is.
ISELUX ULTRA MILD at 30% will increase the viscosity with salt. ingredients in this blend are good foaming agents. You dont need to add any more.
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@PhilGeis I will not purchase them but i have some glyceryl Caprylate in stock and wanted use it in combination with phenoxyethanol in shampoo pH 5 or lotion pH 4 with 0.2% EDTA in both if possible.
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@PhilGeis there is a blend Nipaguard SCP by Clariant phenoxyethanol/sorbitan Caprylate 7/3. I wanted how will it performs if we use glyceryl Caprylate instead of sorbitan Caprylate in this blend.
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@Perry @PhilGeis thanks a lot