[Abdullah]

Gordof said:

it is not problematic in a way of health hazard or anything but it can lead to Irritation at the eyes and Teardrops due to the salt content. 

Thanks 
My concern was also eye and face irritation or drying. 

Interestingly 2-5% NACL functions as OTC medicine for eyes.

https://www.cosmeticsinfo.org/ingredients/sodium-chloride/

[Abdullah]

this is the face wash with 4% NACL from Innospec

[Abdullah]

David said:

Although it really looks like a bad shampoo, I have to give them credit for marketing it with SLES as unique selling point. I can’t remember to ever have  seen a shampoo marketed with the actual ingredient that cleans the hair and creates the foam.

Yes that part is very unique

[Abdullah]

RawMaterialGirl said:

I think the reviews are fake. I make shampoos for a living and this had to be the worst shampoo I’ve ever put in my hair. 

By the way, make sure you were using 4% active SLES (usually it comes in 30% active) vs just 4% of a 30% solution. You might get more foam.

Yes i am talking about 4% active surfactant 

[Abdullah]

That btms would interest with some of your anionic surfactant abd both will become unavailable. So btms not only don’t do any benefit, it also reduces the cleaning power. Only the fatty alcohol part may do some re fatting to hair that you can use it alone if you want. Much better and cheaper.

I would say reduce the fo to ≤0.3%

[Abdullah]

I have seen a patent of niacinamide at pH below 3. Maybe pH of this product is also below 3.

[Abdullah]

@Perry thanks a lot for sharing your experience.
I want to produce a conditioner line and made this sample 
1% SPDMA
1% GMS
2% setearyl alcohol
0.008% tetrasodium EDTA
1% citric acid
0.1% formalin
pH 4

My shampoos has cationic guar and Amodimethicone and good conditioning effects. I didn’t notice any difference between applying it pre or post shampoo versus not applying it at all. 
any recommendation to improve the performance of this conditioner.

@@stefarama was it needed to apply post shampoo conditioner too? 
If yes then from post shampoo conditioner there will be some conditioner left in hair until the next wash so why apply conditioner before next wash? 

[Abdullah]

Zahra said:

Abdullah said:

Zahra said:

Abdullah said:

What is the problem?

You should not use that preservative more than 0.1%.

Abdullah said:

What is the problem?

You should not use that preservative more than 0.1%

Hello

 The problem I have is that when I turn these ratios up and down it does not work properly on damaged hair.

I do not know exactly what percentage of surfactant to add to a hair mask or conditioner after a bath.

Because the amount of surfactants causes more than 5% adhesion or I increase glycerin

Or I have a problem with formaldehyde-free creatine

Yes when you change the ratios you get different results. See what you like the most

Hi thanks

I had a question when I say that the percentage of surfactant like steerium chloride is 5%.

In a solitary concentrate

When several cationic surfactants are added, the permissible percentages of each should be poured or the same as 5?Hi thanks

I had a question when I say that the percentage of surfactant like cetermonium chloride is 5%.

In a solitary concentrate

When several cationic surfactants are added, the permissible percentages of each should be poured or the same as 5?

I think the uper limit of Steriumonium chloride is leave in product is 0.25%.

If you add several surfactants you can add each one to their upper limit.

[Abdullah]

ketchito said:

@Abdullah At a pH between 4-5, you’ll have trisodium EDTA instead of tetrasodium EDTA. 

Is it more effective chelator or less if weit is tri instead of tetra?

[Abdullah]

ketchito said:

Abdullah said:

ngarayeva001 said:

Not directly related to the question but I believe tetrasodium EDTA is to be used in basic not acidic products. You probably need disodium.

A lot of people say so but they don’t say the reason for it and for several reasons i believe this may not be true. 

1. The EDTA part chelates the metals not the sodium part. Sodium only increases the solubility like it does is sodium benzoate and sodium methyl Paraben.
So why would it matter if it has 2 or 4 sodium while there is a lot of sodium in the product anyway?

2. A lot of shampoos have tetrasodium EDTA but pH is not basic like this one 
https://phique.com/product/phique-moisturizing-shampoo/

It’s because of the dissociation constant of each carboxylic group in EDTA. Generally speaking, at a pH higher than 10, your structure will have those 4 carboxylic groups in the anionic state and ready to complex with metal ions. At a pH below 6, you’ll only have 3 (one will be protonated by H+); at pH below 3, you might have only 2 available carboxylic groups in the anionic state…which is basically disodium EDTA. 

One reason to use tetrasodium EDTA in a product with a pH lower than 6 is both it’s availability and current price compared to disodium EDTA. 

So at pH 4-5 tetrasodium EDTA would chelate better or at least the same as disodium EDTA. Did i understand it correctly? 

[Abdullah]

Zahra said:

Abdullah said:

What is the problem?

You should not use that preservative more than 0.1%.

Abdullah said:

What is the problem?

You should not use that preservative more than 0.1%

Hello

 The problem I have is that when I turn these ratios up and down it does not work properly on damaged hair.

I do not know exactly what percentage of surfactant to add to a hair mask or conditioner after a bath.

Because the amount of surfactants causes more than 5% adhesion or I increase glycerin

Or I have a problem with formaldehyde-free creatine

Yes when you change the ratios you get different results. See what you like the most

[Abdullah]

1Armand2 said:

klangridge said:

You have fairly low surfactant levels in this formula -  a normal shampoo tends to have around 12% surfactant overall, which will produce more foam and also the more stable foam you are used to.

I would suggest that an increase in viscosity will aid foam stability, as a thicker bubble wall will be stronger - are you able to introduce another thickener other than salt thickening, and perhaps increase guar level slightly as a foam booster? You may also consider different grades of guar as some are more effective at boosting foam than others - your supplier should be able to help with some suggestions.

Guar increases foam especially in 2 in 1 !

Thanks

[Abdullah]

ngarayeva001 said:

Not directly related to the question but I believe tetrasodium EDTA is to be used in basic not acidic products. You probably need disodium.

A lot of people say so but they don’t say the reason for it and for several reasons i believe this may not be true. 

1. The EDTA part chelates the metals not the sodium part. Sodium only increases the solubility like it does is sodium benzoate and sodium methyl Paraben.
So why would it matter if it has 2 or 4 sodium while there is a lot of sodium in the product anyway?

2. A lot of shampoos have tetrasodium EDTA but pH is not basic like this one 
https://phique.com/product/phique-moisturizing-shampoo/

[Abdullah]

What is the problem?

You should not use that preservative more than 0.1%.

[Abdullah]

Gordof said:

hi sorry did not see that you replayed. 

Tensieds are Surfactants just another name used in Switzerland/ Germany for it. 

so I just wanted to say you need to Pre solubilize the Perfume in your Surfactants.

Sometimes there can be separation if you add it afterward or your product will sometimes not get clear. 

thanks
I am using SLES and CAPB. So i should mix fragrance with CAPB and then add it to shampoo as my SLES is 70%?

[Abdullah]

Paprik said:

@Abdullah, hmmm, as it was cationic system, I’m afraid I won’t be able to help. Usually chelating agent helps with this issue. 
Did you have enough antioxidant in the formula? 

I didn’t have any antioxidant or chelating agent in that. 
The oils were 0.1% rose fragrance oil, 1% olive oil and 4% petrolatum. 

[Abdullah]

Paprik said:

Yeah, first coming on my mind is microbial contamination. 
Also acid environment can turn emulsion pink sometimes. 
do you know the reason for this color change? One of my samples changed pinkish too and i couldn’t know what was the reason. It was a cationic emulsion.

[Abdullah]

As @Mondonna said, see what size your competitors use. Or what size the most selling product in that category use. 

[Abdullah]

Use phenoxyethanol or DMDM hydantoin with Paraben or IPBC.

[Abdullah]

Thanks a lot for suggestions

[Abdullah]

@chemicalmatt thanks a lot

Which part is the stabilizer ring? 

[Abdullah]

Can you share the picture?

[Abdullah]

Paprik said:

@Abdullah, sorry mate, I do not answer for this.
I mostly use 350 at 1 - 2%. 
I bought the 10 fluid just for the feel, but haven’t really work with it yet. 

No problem

[Abdullah]

This comparison

[Abdullah]

This comparison