Cosmetic Science Talk

Cosmetic Science discussion form. For people who want for formulate cosmetics and get advice from other formulators around the world.

Home Cosmetic Science Talk Skin Is applying conditioner before shampoo is better than after shampoo as said here?

  • Perry

    Member
    March 3, 2022 at 1:24 pm

    I used to work on a product called VO5 Hot Oil Treatment. It was really just a conditioner (main functional ingredient Cocotrimonium Chloride and a cationic polymer called PEI).

    The idea was that you put it on the hair first, leave it for a couple minutes, rinse and apply shampoo. So, this product was essentially “applying conditioner before shampoo”.

    If you used the Hot Oil then shampooed and didn’t use a conditioner after shampooing, hair was left in better shape than if you just shampooed. But if you shampooed then used conditioner, there really wasn’t much difference.

    Personally, I doubt conditioning before shampooing results in any real noticeable conditioning effects.

  • imported_stefarama

    Member
    March 3, 2022 at 10:20 pm

    On the salon side, we recommend this for damaged hair.  The idea for us is that since shampoo wants to pull out dirt and oil, but damaged ends have neither, conditioning the ends first gives the shampoo something to do without further drying out the ends. We then recommending conditioning after shampooing as usual.  Would love to hear if there is any chemistry to back this up. :)

  • Abdullah

    Member
    March 4, 2022 at 1:54 am

    @Perry thanks a lot for sharing your experience.
    I want to produce a conditioner line and made this sample 
    1% SPDMA
    1% GMS
    2% setearyl alcohol
    0.008% tetrasodium EDTA
    1% citric acid
    0.1% formalin
    pH 4

    My shampoos has cationic guar and Amodimethicone and good conditioning effects. I didn’t notice any difference between applying it pre or post shampoo versus not applying it at all. 
    any recommendation to improve the performance of this conditioner.

    @@stefarama was it needed to apply post shampoo conditioner too? 
    If yes then from post shampoo conditioner there will be some conditioner left in hair until the next wash so why apply conditioner before next wash? 

  • ProfessorHerb

    Member
    March 10, 2022 at 5:20 am

    Both and different kinds. My aging hair looks like it did in my teens. I use a lipid heavy conditioner (more than 10%) lipids before shampooing and then a very light conditioner after (less than 5% lipids but a higher than average amount of cationic ingredient as well as 20% or more humectants). Then after i spritz with a marshmallow hair mist with no cationic or lipid ingredient. The hsampoo bar I created is gentle, soft and hydrating so soemtimes I skip the conditioner after. I don’t have damaged or dry hair anymore despite going to a salon once a year.

  • Abdullah

    Member
    March 10, 2022 at 6:40 am

    @ProfessorHerb very interesting

    1. Are these conditioners leave in or rinse off?

    2. Are the oils silicone or plant Oil?

    3. Do you make these products yourself or they are commercial?

    4. What is the function of ≥20% humectant in conditioner?

    In skin we use humectants to attract water and keep the skin moist? Do you want it to attract water to hair too and keep it always moist? 

  • ProfessorHerb

    Member
    March 10, 2022 at 8:12 am
    Two are rinse off and one is leave in but a water based plant conditioner so not a traditional conditioner.
    No silicones.
    I make them all now but sometimes buy.
    The texture of vegetable glycerine in shampoo and conditioner is unparalleled. My hair products are very popular and get rave reviews. One secret is the humectants I use and the large proportion of vegetable glycerine. 
  • Abdullah

    Member
    March 10, 2022 at 2:16 pm

    Two are rinse off and one is leave in but a water based plant conditioner so not a traditional conditioner.
    No silicones.
    I make them all now but sometimes buy.
    The texture of vegetable glycerine in shampoo and conditioner is unparalleled. My hair products are very popular and get rave reviews. One secret is the humectants I use and the large proportion of vegetable glycerine. 

    Thanks for sharing