Abdullah
Forum Replies Created
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GeorgeBenson said:@Abdullah where do you source your caprylhydroxamic acid? I’d like to try it but can’t find it anywhere, same with chlorphenesin.I purchase most of my ingredients from china including caprylhydroxamic acid.
I would suggest you use IPBC instead of caprylhydroxamic acid. I would also do so when i finish this batch of caprylhydroxamic acid that i have purchased.
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Graillotion said:I also use PE 9010 + some other things and have never had issue with yeast/mold….yet always have that nagging feeling I should add something for y/m. If Sodium Benzoate is a possible irritant….is there another option…that just brings the y/m…but doesn’t bring any irritation to the table? Just looking for the best possible y/m protection…without possible irritation….(and open to synthetics). I always formulate in the range of 4.4-5.2.
PE 9010 os ok for shampoo but for non-ionic emulsions not trustworthy for fungi.
Several months ago One of my lotion samples preserved with phenoxyethanol/caprylyl glycol @9/1 ratio which is kind of similar to this one did start producing gas after a month or two of production. Mr Perry said candida contamination can be the cause. So i added 0.15% caprylhydroxamic acid to see what will happen. and there was no more gas production anymore. It is stable, no smell or color change and no more gas production up to this time.
Although i did not use that batch after that gas production. Just keeping it for observation purpose. -
What is the pH?
Maybe your product is contaminated and that is causing this.
Lactic and citric acid is not the problem.
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Phenoxyethanol is milder than sodium benzoate and potassium sorbate but they target different microbes. Phenoxyethanol is for bacteria and sb&ps is for fungi.
Also i think currently phenoxyethanol is the number one most used preservative in cosmetics. It means it is well tolerated and doesn’t have bad reputation for majority of people.
Why do you think it has bad reputation or people may have reaction with it?
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Graillotion said:Bingo on the above… pH and niacinamide is the perfect example of mommy blogger lore….repeated and Repeated and REPEATED….SO MUSH SO, that some of the repackers (which are sometimes started by mommy bloggers) will repeat the lore. They are 100% cut and paste on their descriptions. NO RESEARCH!
So a long time ago…a mommy blogger read the above described paper….was not able to understand it….wrote an incorrect blog…that one bloggers misunderstanding of basic information has become the Bible for the bloggers… cut and paste, Cut AND Paste, CUT AND PASTE….Is that not the saddest thing you have read all week?
I formulate at 3 different pH’s (based on product type), 4.4 and 4.8 and 5.2. All products use niacinamide.
Hahaha
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Using sodium stearoyl lactylate+cationic guar+xanthan gum+ Amodimethicone macro emulsion+ 3% NACL in shampoo
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Maybe that product has high amount of cationic guar and Acacia Senegal Gum and viscosity.
Or maybe everything after decyl Glucoside is below 1%, glycols are in very small amount and actual opacity of product is caused by combination of other ingredients.
I am making a line of shampoo that looks as opaque as 1% egds without any pearlizer.
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It is fine to use at lower pH. Don’t worry
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Your product pH also has a roll.
Use the lowest pH your skin and formula can tolerate.
4 is best.
5 is good.
Anything above 5, i don’t like it. Specially for eczema. -
Do you mean that your product doesn’t make a dry skin soft and moist or you mean upon application it doesn’t feel moisturized and moist?
If first one then the only two ingredients in your formula for that purpose is petrolatum and glycerin. I suggest 18% glycerine+ 5% petrolatum. That is enough in oil phase. Also as Graillotion said 1% dimethicone will help too. Mixing humectants is also better than one. I suggest add 2% lactic acid too and adjust pH.
Adding vegetable oils like sesame oil without antioxidant is not a good idea.If second one then remember this. In o/w emulsion, water is your continues phase so your skin with first feel whatever is in that phase. Then every droplets of oil phase is surrounded by surfactants or emulsifiers so it is emulsifier that will contact your skin. Not the oils. So you will not see much difference between sesame oil vs olive oil in oil phase but you would see a huge difference if you use an emulsifier with oleic or behenic in it. So for feeling moisturized during application or shortly after use an emulsifier with oleic or behenic in it.
About irritation, maybe it is rice but if irritation is not present from the first day then maybe your product is contaminated.
You don’t have a strong preservative specially for fungi. -
Looks like it has pH 14.
Before thickening it use it one or two time and see if your hands can tolerate it.
Or put it in a metal dish and see what happens. In my experience even metals dont tolerate pH 14.
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Those with higher molecular weight give higher viscosity.
A supplier suggested me 1.8 million Da at 0.1% but i didn’t purchase and use the product myself.
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ketchito said:@Abdullah By dry hair I was just referring to free water (there will always be some water within the cortex, but that’s bound water, and won’t act as solvent for actives). When hair loses lipids, it loses insulation, which means water exchange with the environment is more constant and dependent on factors like temperature.
Thanks
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What is your formula?
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Citric acid doesn’t have another function than lowering the pH.
What is the amount of each ingredient you use?
Maybe it is DEA -
@ketchito i was thinking hair is different from the skin. If it is dry, it meaans it lacks lipids, not water.
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What percentage of preservative did you use?
I suggest you use a blend that has parabens or IPBC in it witha a chelating agent.
There are a lot of parabens or IPBC in phenoxyethanol products.
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ketchito said:@Abdullah No worries! So, conditioning agents to go where they’re supposed to go, need certain media (polar) to move and diffuse, and water is the perfect media…also, to keep both hair and conditioning agents in the right ionic state for deposition to occur. If your hair is dry, you won’t have this available (except for the water from your product and the one that is bound to the most external layer of your hair, which is barely enough). An exception to this are anhydrous oils, which composition is obviously water free (natural oils, esters, silicones) and whose coating function requires no charge interaction.
Isn’t the water in conditioner enough?
Conditioners are more than 90% water.
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Paprik said:Well, that depends. In hair masks for very dry and damaged hair it is really beneficial. As it draws moisture to the porous and damaged/dry hair. Same as conditioner (it also prevents drying of the product), but it helps retain some of the moisture so the hair don’t get super dry after - Plus it fights frizziness.
In my (humble) opinion, it is good to have a good humectant in hair products.
And @Camel, yeah, 2% should be fine. Try it out and see.
Thanks
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ketchito said:Also, you need some media to let conditioning agents diffuse…it’d be like trying to swim in a pool with no water (not sure this is a good analogy, though ????)
Can you explain it a bit more.
I couldn’t understand it ????
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@Paprik can you explain what is the benefit of humectant like glycerin for hair?
In my opinion humectants attract water and we don’t want water in our hair.
I am ready to change my opinion.
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I will remove pq10
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@Graillotion @justaerin is the motor ac or dc?
I mean can can it work continually like big homogenizers or just a few minutes like stick blenders?
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Who advise so?
I think it works better if hair is dry.
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Do you want slip during application or overall slip for hair?
If for during application then use some HEC.
If for overall slip then just use 4% BTMS-25, water and preservative. This will make a good conditioner.
Non of your other ingredients will help the slip in anyway.