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How do I use liquid carbomer to thicken my product?
Hi all,
I’m making a facial Cleanser with a pH between 4-5. The ingredients are:
Water
1% liquid carbomer
0.2% GLDA
Sodium lauryl glucose carboxylate
Glyceryl oleate & coco glucoside
Sodium lauroamphoacetate
Phenoxy & EHG
Sodium benzoate & Potassium Sorbate
Fragrance
I added a drop of baking soda to the water first to increase the pH to 8. Then I added the liquid carbomer and GLDA then added it into the surfactants when I lowered the pH to 4.5 the cleanser didn’t thicken. I’m not sure why, I’ve never worked with a liquid carbomer before. I’ve waited for few days and the cleanser is still runny. Where do you think I went wrong?
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9 Replies
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Well one thing is that Carbomer doesn’t work very well with electrolytes like sodium benzoate. Also, you should neutralize Carbomer at the end, not at the start.
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I see, would you recommend using either liquid germal plus or parabens instead of sodium benzoate? As for neutralizing the Carbomer, do I increase the pH at the end then decrease it to 4-5 and that should thicken it?
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I think you need to more clearly define what exactly is “liquid carbomer”. There are many acrylate liquid rheology modifiers, most are 30% activity, and some are geared towards thickening surfactant systems. Others are not. If you are using one of the 30% acrylics suitable for your shampoo formula, then 1.0% w/w (0.30% solid) is far too short. Start with 3.50% and go from there. I would not adjust the pH below pH5.0 either. None of these build well below that pH and without the acid salt preservatives (as Perry remarked) you won’t need to.
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I’m not sure what type it is, the supplier’s website only states that it’s an acrylate copolymer in its acid form, and the pH must be increased to thicken. I’ve emailed the supplier to ask what kind it is, I’ll see what they say.
As to the pH of the product, 5 is fine. I’ve put 4-5 because of the benzoate, but I can use LG+ instead since benzoate doesn’t work well with carbomer
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The supplier says it’s a lightly cross-linked acrylic polymer with approx 30% active. That explains why it didn’t thicken
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I would also suggest that you use NaOH rather than “baking soda” to raise the pH.
As @Perry44 mentioned it is also not very electrolyte tolerant.
If you read some of the Technical assets from Lubrizol, they suggest neutralizing to a pH of 8 or so and then reducing the pH to your final level.
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This reply was modified 3 weeks ago by Microformulation.
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Thanks for the tip! I did a test batch and neutralized it to pH 8 then reduced the pH to 5.3 and the thickness thinned out and became runny again. So I tried a different method, where I neutralized the carbomer in a separate beaker, and I added all the other ingredients in another beaker and adjusted the pH to 5.3. I then added the neutralized Carbomer and stirrer until it was well incorporated and that seemed to keep the thickens. It only thinned out a little, but it’s a lot better than the previous testing. Thankfully the remained the same which is good.
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Look closely at your supplier’s documentation. Is it possible you are using a pre-neutralized Sodium Carbomer?
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It says the carbomer is in its acid (2.1-4.0) form which is why it’s liquid. I assume that means it’s preneutralized? It recommends increasing the pH to thicken it.
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This reply was modified 3 weeks ago by
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