PhilGeis
Forum Replies Created
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Abdullah said:
It is unstable emulsion and creaming is happening.leaf water as first ingredient and not stable emulsion. preservatives don’t work correctly in my experience in unstable emulsions. How much is the shelf life of this product?
Good point! They should consider micro stability in context of each distinct phase and consumer use through frequent shaken suspensions and separations.
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Abdullah said:@Pharma @PhilGeis this product doesn’t have anything other than water and chelating agent. Why would microbes grow there?
How much phytic acid and hexametaphosphate makes 1L hard water soft?
Bacteria can grow in distilled water - there is no need for what folks think of as “bug food”.
How much theoretically depends on how hard you anticipate water to be.
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As Pharma said, you’ll need a preservative and prob a sodium salt of EDTA..
Eco-friendly - gack - meaningless advertising for the rubes. Your proposed use is irrelevant to the environment. -
EDTA does disrupt microbial biofilm.
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Great comments from pharma.
chickenskin said:
@PharmaThank you for the thoughts on this. For interactions you answered what I was looking for. My plan is to make a cream with about 10%-15% Progesterone. This will not be labeled with any claims or intended use/dosage. Can’t find much on the web beyond basic compounding formulas using stock base from PCCA.
No claims? Why are you using the stuff?
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Ask for the lab so you can directly inquire. I’d not work through a broker. I think ISO 17025 does not address technical elements of tests per se but more the management, flow and supporting elements like calibration.
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Chemicals can have effects - in “essential oil” or otherwise.
e.g. vicks VapoRub https://www.scirp.org/journal/PaperInformation.aspx?PaperID=53518
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QC micro should be on your ZPT spec.
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Think you’d find it - at some level.
In addition to reproducibility, wonder at the risk assessment re. levels found. Press release refers to 2 ppm benzene in sanitizer. There, focus was on technical/industrial grade ethanol and FDA saw 2 ppm as acceptable for limited exposure in context of need for santiizers. https://www.fda.gov/media/136289/downloadThere is the soft drink - benzoic acid/vitamin c /benzene issue.. Here they were talking about ppb levels. https://www.fda.gov/food/chemicals/benzene
Valisure is a new bunch - founded in 2015 - wonder how much of this is publicity., even if accurate as reported.
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I’d 1st decide what is “natural.” Obtained unchanged from nature of the head fake of naturally derived, Ecocert, etc.
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Think the 1st question might be the valaidity of the testing and the accuracy of report - that I’m sure the FDA is currently addressing.
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Suggest you ask for their last FDA audit.
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Pattsi said:It is what it is - a separated emulsion.
Not really bi-phasic like makeup remover - it takes time to separate back to 2 layers.
The ingredient that was left out is Marketinga Moneyeta.Marketinga Moneyata!!!!!
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no can’t help with that
btw - meant NO efficacy with soluble PT
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Try 2500 of each.
EDTA and other chelators will sequester Zn from ZPT. ZPT is used as it it is substantive to the scalp where it inhibits Malassezia spp. fungi. Soluble PT (Na) will not deposit - so efficacy. -
Nope. Suggest benzoate and a formaldehyde releaser. Also might look at Head & Shoulders.
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Eliminate EDTA - you’ll screw up your ZPT. As Abdullah said - preservatives are must too great in concentration and prob not the best choice as ZPT and isothiazolinones can be incompatible.
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ifamuj said:
How about I use a mixture of DMDM (0.5%) and methylparaben (0.2%) and add 0.2% disodium EDTA?
That would be good but cut down on levels 2000 ppm DMDMH/1000 Methyl parabens/1000 Na2EDTA. What is the packaging and how do you plan to limit use to 3 months?
Premade solution? You will need to preserve premixes - if they exist for > 6 hours. -
Dreamer - where do you access relevant clinical trial data for peptides?
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Nothing as good as Mark’s - just antimicrobial toilet paper
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2:1 - often 2000/1000 ppm.
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Appropriately-designed - published in peer-reviewed context that address efficacy, nature and limitations of your formulas can be informative. Pictures such as those above offered as “proof” for alleged efficacy are neither novel nor compelling.
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SymOcide from Symrise.
https://www.imcdus.com/en-us/products/symocide-c. Think it’s not very soluble and question “excellent antifungal, antiseptic and preservative properties” -sounds like the usual “broad spectrum hype.
Symrise offers the stuff as “when properly used, can preserve many cosmetic products effectively. Particularly in combination with organic acids or other multifunctional ingredients,”https://www.cosmeticsandtoiletries.com/formulating/function/preservatives/Glide-Down-the-SymOcide-C-Slide-407782735.htmlA lot of literature re dentifrice application. Other than that, I don’t know why anyone would be using triclosan in any application that would warrant replacement.
Here’s CIR https://online.personalcarecouncil.org/ctfa-static/online/lists/cir-pdfs/PRS277.pdf -
preservative free
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One USP 51 by itself is not enough - you should ensure the preservative system is stable.
“Safety” by whatever tests or rational must be established. It can not be presumed, one must have an affirmative justification.
Per 21 CFR
A cosmetic is considered misbranded if its safety has not adequately been substantiated, and it does not bear the following conspicuous statement on the PDP:Warning - The safety of this product has not been determined.