PhilGeis
Forum Replies Created
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What size tank? Spray balls? What type of product residue?
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It’s associated with the addition of which preservative?
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Come on!. Put some skin in the game - try it where the sun don’t shine! How else will you know its effect - good or bad..
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Biphasic - as in ribbons? Preservative migration is no more and prob much less a concern than with emulsion. But use preservatives with great water solubility.
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You’ll need preservation. Suggest Neolone or Dantogard with a chelator such as EDTA.
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Hold mother of pearl!! Finally, the miracle. Think secret was the magnetism. Looks like I’m out of a job.
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FD&C Act definition of “cosmetic” has 2 sections. The one with which we are familiar and the second:
.. (2) articles intended for use as a component of any such articles; except that such term shall not include soap.”
Ingredients of cosmetics are themselves cosmetics. FDA BAM established 1000 cfu/g as limit for all other….
Not aware folks have been busted on this alone - but prob would come out as 483 item in an audit.
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btw - this does show the supplier as full of crap - calling it “Cosmetic Grade”
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Might consider Univ Cinc. https://online.uc.edu/masters-programs/ms-in-cosmetic-science/faculty/
Faculty is big company credentialed (GSK, P&G, Unilever). Can’t address courses directly - but for the Manuf. Hygiene for which I’m faculty and confident there is no competitive course.
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This is a tough one. Anything approaching 1% would risk OOS and FDA would take a dim view that the preservative system was used to clean up almost 10,000/gram.
I do think calling it “cosmetic grade” is BS.
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Based on current ads, they’re claiming lowered pH as basis.
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Doesn’t offer reference to what standard it “conforms.” A lot of foods have counts - hamburger a million per gram or more and much of it E. coli. Food micro is more focused on specific pathogens than total counts.
I don’t know about the material here as a food but it is clearly not acceptable as a cosmetic ingredient.
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prob does not matter if well preserved
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Sorry -see you did note pH and application. Don’t think organic acids will help.
As noted aloe and oatmeal (your therapeutic actives?) are working against you as well as order of addition and apparent absence of RM qualification/finished product testing. With such rapid mold development, wonder if bacteria contamination as well.
I appreciate your desire to help you sister but, considering potential infection of psoriatic skin, do not think you have the resources and knowledge necessary to offer a safe product beyond short refrigerated shelf life.
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What were challenge test data vs Aspergillus brasiliensis? Or are are you testing?
What is pH?
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Ingredient preservatives are not usually listed.
It may have been as oldperry suggested or that this level of preservation was needed to pass their challenge test. Most major companies do not use USP 51 per se - it’s a pretty weak test. They add relevant manufacturing and consumer return bugs. On its face, there nothing wrong with this combination, esp. as we do not know the levels.
DMDM Hydantoin is not great vs fungi. Surfactant products are typically more resistant to fungi.
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Chelator is useful in preservation. Not sure its surface safety in your application.
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As in the microbial encountered in manufacturing - e.g. do you clean and sanitize equipment, control micro content of raw materials?
Rarely is one preservative enough. In this case, I anticipate the above will not be in control and application will bring water addition. If using only one - use the formaldehyde releaser.
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Should be ok. ~ 0.5% (5000 ppm) phenoxy and 0.3% Na benzoate.
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It’s not that great a system anyway. Why not try something more pedestrian like benzoate/phenoxy.
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Some of those are +/- garbage in any use and, if you’re in US, don’t think any are legal in your application. A formaldehyde releaser such as Sodium Hydroxymethyl glycinate with phenoxyethanol might work if your making is reasonably clean, BUT to be legal you need to find versions compliant to relevant biocidal/pesticide regs. - in US, registered as EPA pesticidal preservatives..
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Methyl isothiazolinone (MIT) and Dimethyl dimethylol hydantoin (DMDM hydantoin)
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Maybe tell them Elliot. I know P&G would want to know if it was a problem with Tide pods
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You should use only in shampoos, conditioners, hand soaps - products that you rinse off after use. Never use in creams, lotions, makeup - products that are applied and left on.
5 ppm is plenty
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Model is Kathon CG- supplied as 1.5% active - the target in formula should be no more than 7.5 ppm active. 15 ppm active is too much. I use 5 ppm, and some claim synergy with formaldehyde releasers at less.
When 1st marketed, folks used too much - 15 ppm and more provoking a lot of sensitization. Still recognized as risk for sensitization. Now it’s used only in rinse off products.