PeaceLoveNaturals
Forum Replies Created
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@belassi well I guess I got to get a learning then because that is my focus, hair care. Im a Licensed Hair Stylist by trade turned fashion designer/ stay at home momma. Trying to get back to my passion for hair. My body care products are more of a hobby because I also practice herbalism and its great to add those infused oils into body care items.
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Graillotion said:Agreed….everything I read about oils in haircare…..Label enhancers.
You don’t have to be an unknown…to make a bad label.
lol true that
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@Cafe33 thanks so much! its always humbling to be in a place of utter ignorance lol. Im genuinely learning though and its so helpful to be apart of this forum.
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Belassi said:Each surfactant has its own properties profile so by mixing different types it is possible to produce the profile you want to achieve. For instance, sodium cocoamphoacetate is good for dense, small-bubble foam.
I have Sodium Cocoa and Coco Betain. Any preference?
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Graillotion said:PeaceLoveNaturals said:
Why is it when you say this…I immediately think….they don’t know how to make a correct label? How many small brands have we seen….that just put the ingredients in the order they think is most appealing?
You know how little Vitamin E goes into a product…and it is ahead of the Behentrimonium Methosulfate? Argan oil is expensive…so probaly measured in drops. you think the labeling may be wrong? their quite a popular indie brand…been in magazines and such….I am just trying to figure out really how much or little oil/butter I should put into a formula and beginner me is looking at this label thinking dang theres a lot of oil and butter here! lol hence my thought process going into my bad first attempt at a conditioner. lol
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Cafe33 said:They could be using as little as 2% of BTMS-25. Assuming it is at 2%, the amount of Cetearyl alcohol would be around 1.5% and BTMS would be at 0.5%. Cetrimonium Chloride is the main “detangler” here. It can work very well with as little as 0.3%.
if their using BTMS 25 at 2% then wouldnt BTMS be up at the top not below? And these ingredient would really work well at such low %? I assumed cetearyl would be much more then 1.5%…..so what would you assume the total emulsifier to oil there is?
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these look like they may be more then 1% but now Im wondering. Here take a look and see what you think? There are some Essential Oils, I havent highlighted those. I wonder because BTMS is so low on the list. I would asume more then 1% would be used in a leave in conditioner? And I have this leave in conditioner. Its moisturizing but not at all heavy like you would think.
Leave In Conditioner from and Indie Brand: Water, Cetearyl Alcohol, Simmondsia Chinesis (Jojoba) Seed oil, Ethylhexyl Palmitate, Olea Europe (Olive) Fruit oil, Glyceryl Stearate, Astrocaryum Murumuru Seed butter, Argania Spinosa Kernel oil (Argan oil), Butyrospermum Parkii (Shea) Butter, Persea Gratissima (Avocado) Oil, Rosa Centifolia (Rose oil), Citrus Aurantium Amara (Neroli) Oil, Tocopheryl Acetate (Vitamin E), Behentrimonium Methosulfate, Cetrimonium Chloride, Biotin, *Nigella Sativa (Virgin Black Cumin) Oil, Trigonella Foenum-Graecum (Fenugreek) Seed Extract, Phenoxyethanol, Ethylhexylglycerin, Fragrance (Phthalate Free).
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oh no haha ya I have thought about that too, I guess I assume I can find it somewhere right? haha
oh and IG is Instagram
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@Pharma I decided to use it again without the gross chamomile hydrosal overload in a simple emulsion and I can now see what you mean by a possible amaretto smell. Its not as unpleasant as it was in my other formula. Does still remind me of hair lice treatment haha wonder why…
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@Belassi Thanks, all Ive ever known is it being great for hair and scalp. Maybe not something thats great for formulating?
Idk but as a treatment its amazing really and healing. But Im also coming from and herbalist hippi dippi point of view and not so much a science/formulating point of view.
How companies formulate with oils, I have no clue …so its all trial and error for me right now. I can only guess what % is being use by looking at the ingredients list.
I will see an Indie brand with 5 oils and 2 butters in their conditioner ingredients, but when I use it, it doesnt feel heavy or too thick. I am white/european too so I dont have a courser hair type that tend to do very well with oils and butters. So how are these brands formulating with it? .10%, .25% each oil? Seems silly really to have a list of exotic butter and oils and only use 2% as a whole. But hey it works for them I guess. I have to rethink my whole “branding” concept.
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@LuisJavier So whats the funky smell in Geogard ECT? INCI: Benzyl Alcohol & Salicylic Acid & Glycerin & Sorbic Acid
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@pharma Floral? haha thats how you describe it? Yuck now way it (Geogard ECT) legit smells like head lice treatment. I wasnt sure what it was in the preservative. I looked up Benzy funky smell…and articals did pop up saying it did have a very off putting odor so I can only assume thats what is making geogard ect smell so horrible.
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I ended up buying a $90 overhead mixer. Just used it today. Unfortunately even $200 is a bit out of my budget right now.
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@Graillotion I actually got a sample from Evonik
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@Belassi I didnt know that about Olive oil…very interesting. Hmm then what to do with a gallon of herbal infused Olive oil? hahaha
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@Graillotion
Oh shnap I need to go on there now haha -
@Cafe33 thanks so much I will look into natrasil
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@Graillotion I just purchased a $90 overhead stirrir for now. Hopefully that will be sufficient for what Im doing. I watched some videos on why one would need a homogenizer verse just a stirrer and it seemed like the stirrir was more universal? I guess not everything needs homogenized, but most everything can be stirred? Am I wrong? I know there are some thing that require a homogenizer, but is it more of a preference? Do you have an IG?
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@Graillotion hey thank so much! I was just thinking that today; that I may make a larger batch and scent test it that way.
And too Im going back to basics and I think Im going to do simple emulsification to see the smell and texture of each of my emulsifiers.
I keep thinking…hmm is that smell the emulsifier or the scent?!…I honestly never just did 1 emulsifier formulas. I just jumped right into my formulas…
Ive made a leave in conditioner, it separated already and felt and smelt yuck! I made a deep conditioner, it felt so displeasing in the shower and smelt ehh, bad too but not as bad. I kinda felt like I couls smell more “product” then the fragrance was bad (does that make sense?). I made 2 body lotions, the first I used wayyy too much floral hydrosol that I didnt really like anyways and a preservative that made it smell like lice solution. The second I used a combo of hydrosols (trying to experiment with scenting the product with hydrosols verse fragrance…more for facial products then body lotions…I dont mind fragrance in body products)… Im wondering if I can damage the floral scent in them during the heating phase because my product smelt like burnt wilted flowers haha. The texture is nice though. I ended up adding some essential oil and my husband says it smells nice, Im not so sure haha.
I just purchased a “cheaper” overhead stirrer because I’ve been having to use my mini wisk and yes I am still seeing very small flecks of wax when I go to rub on the lotion.
Ive been using Montanov 68, Olivem 1000, Varisoft EQ…then Ill add some Cetyl Alcohol and Glycerl Stearate Citrate in my lotions.
I have a stick thermometer and it takes forever to take the temp. I should have purchased the touchless at $25 before they all jumped to $40-60 with corona virus haha goodness!
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@Graillotion not so much a label thing more so a “I have it and need to use it in something” haha a waste concern I guess.
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@Pharma I agree I thought the castor was overkill. Honestly I have it sitting around and am trying to find ways to use it haha. I planned on formulating a scalp treatment so I will keep it for that.
So use the oils more for a leave on products and not a wash off conditioner? So it was meant as a “deep conditioner treatment” would that make a difference though as to upping the oil? Im using an herbal infused oil so I just wanted to feel like the product, the potential customer was benefiting from the “herbal” aspect.
Ok I will def up my fatty alcohol! thanks! might try this today. I was going to do a second attempt at a lotion but might do this instead.
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@Pharma no I feel ya. and thank you I was on the right page with the qac.
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@Graillotion And would $300 be affordable for a homogenizer?
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@EVchem thanks so much that is helpful. Any blends you have found work well? I think Im mainly struggling with skincare as I want to make skincare thats directed towards sensitive skin types and I hear many preservatives can be irritating.
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@Pharma lol omg yes i meant olivem! Thank you that makes sense. Still figuring out what everything is and does. Thank you
