[Gunther]

It sounds like Platelet Rich Plasma
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2609914/
with Heparin to prevent blood from coagulating.

It’s enticing to:
1 have your own blood drawn
2 chemically treat it (they use Calcium chloride, I believe)
3 centrifuge it
4 sterile filter it (to prevent it from going sour)
5 mix it in a proper transdermal delivery cream
6 claim 100% natural, 100% renewable carbon, not tested on animals, bioidentical, and so on.

Transdermal delivery of human epidermal growth factor facilitated by a peptide chaperon.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23385091

Enhanced transdermal delivery of epidermal growth factor facilitated by dual peptide chaperone motifs.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24364869

Transdermal Vascular Endothelial Growth Factor Delivery with Surface Engineered Gold Nanoparticles.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28112909

[Gunther]

Thanks guys I’ll try that.
I just ordered some HPMC to give it a try

In this sample formulation from Evonik HPMC made foam clearly “tighter”, as seen in the pics

Formulation:
9.0 % Sodium Laureth Sulfate (Texapon NSO)

3.0 % Cocamidopropyl Betaine (TEGO® Betain F 50)

0.7 % Sodium Chloride

2.0 % Polyglyceryl-3 Caprate (TEGOSOFT® PC 31)

0.3 % Hydroxypropyl Methylcellulose (1.2 % TEGOCEL® fluid HPM 4000) resp. 0 % TEGOCEL® fluid HPM 4000
in control formulation
https://personal-care.evonik.com/product/personal-care/Documents/sofw-tegocel.pdf

I was about to try removing or sharply lowering CAPB to reduce viscosity
but they took Cocamide/Oleamide off.

[Gunther]

safbaby.com?
Well at least they didn’t quote EWG as an authoritative source, so that’s a start, isn’t it?

Now seriously
several studies say Zinc oxide ain’t irritating. Not even nano-particles in cell culture studies have shown any harm.

if anything it looks like particles were too big and clumped together, thus mechanically grinding the skin.

This study points out that ZnO nanoparticles are fount to be non-irritant and better dispersed in Tween 80 than distilled water, methylcellulose and corn oil.
Safety evaluation of zinc oxide nanoparticles in terms of acute dermal toxicity, dermal irritation and corrosion, and skin sensitization.
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s13273-016-0012-3

This study even proves that ZnO/petrolatum diapers reduce skin barrier damage erythema:

Skin benefits from continuous topical administration of a zinc oxide/petrolatum formulation by a novel disposable diaper

S Baldwin  M R Odio  S L Haines  R J O’Connor  J S Englehart  A T Lane

First published: 21 December 2001

https://doi.org/10.1046/j.0926-9959.2001.00002.x

Abstract

Background

Diaper dermatitis is a common childhood affliction. Aiming to help reduce the prevalence of this problem, we have advanced in our development of a novel diaper that delivers dermatological formulations to help protect the skin from over‐hydration and irritation.

Objective

To determine the clinical benefits of a novel disposable diaper designed to deliver a zinc oxide and petrolatum‐based formulation continuously to the skin during use.

Methods

All studies were independent, blinded, randomized clinical trials. Study A was conducted to confirm transfer of the zinc oxide/petrolatum (ZnO/Pet) formulation from the diaper to the child’s skin during use. Children wore a single diaper for 3 h or multiple diapers for 24 h. After the use period, stratum corneum samples were taken from each child and analysed for ZnO/Pet. Study B evaluated the prevention of skin irritation and barrier damage from a standard skin irritant (SLS) in an adult arm model. Study C evaluated skin erythema and diaper rash in 268 infants over a 4‐week usage period. One half of the infants used the ZnO/Pet diaper, while the other half used a control diaper that was identical except for the absence of the ZnO/Pet formulation.

Results

The ointment formulation and ZnO transferred effectively from the diaper to the child’s skin during product use. Transfer of ZnO increased from 4.2 µg/cm2 at 3 h to > 8 µg/cm2 at 24 h. Exposure to the formulations directly on adult skin prior to an irritant challenge was associated with up to a 3.5 reduction in skin barrier damage and skin erythema. Greatest reductions were seen for the ZnO containing formulations. Wearing of the formulation treated diaper was also associated with a significant reduction in skin erythema and diaper rash compared to the control product.

Conclusions

The results demonstrated the clinical benefits associated with continuous topical administration of a zinc oxide/petrolatum‐based formulation by this novel diaper.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1046/j.0926-9959.2001.00002.x

[Gunther]

@Aldyppratama I got a feeling that your formula will benefit from adding Isopropyl Myristate, especially considering the high percentage of Lanolin in it.

For genereal guidance please check out this patents on Isopropyl Myristate + Lanolin
although they don’t fully apply to fiber waxes.

https://patents.google.com/patent/US3052608

https://patents.google.com/patent/US3210248A/en

[Gunther]

Does mixing everything at a higher than normal concentration, and then diluting with water to reach normal concentrations
yields lower final viscosity, than mixing at normal concentrations from the beginning?

My experiments suggest so.
Maybe mixing concentrated ingredients creates some molecular attraction forces, that added water then weakens?

Thanks to you all.

[Gunther]

Be careful with fumed silica as it doesn’t dissolve in water (or oil) 
so it must be a very fine powder and properly mixed to avoid lumps that may scratch the skin.

If you still want to go that route
at least get colloidal silicon dioxide
that’s designed to disperse in water.

[Gunther]

https://chemistscorner.com/cosmeticsciencetalk/discussion/3757/stable-hydroquinone-cream-formulation

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/6308987_A_hydroquinone_formulation_with_increased_stability_and_decreased_potential_for_irritation

[Gunther]

Zinc pyrithione is mostly water insoluble
http://www.janssenpmp.com/downloadfile/400.pdf

Just search sample anti-dandruff formulas in the large chemicals manufacturers websites
They often use Carbopol to keep it suspended as Drbob just said
https://www.ulprospector.com/en/eu/PersonalCare/Detail/77/20050/Anti-Dandruff-Shampoo-With-Zinc-Pyrithione-Formulation-SH-0015

[Gunther]

I’m just curious if you’re researching these chemicals for a skin whitening cream?

[Gunther]

DMAE, Diaminoethanol
as the name says has 2 functional groups:
Amino ( N-CH3 ) and alcohol ( -OH )
the amino one can react with acids, so it’s better to have it in salt form to avoid cross-reactions.

https://www.sigmaaldrich.com/catalog/product/sial/38990?lang=en&region=US

The alcohol group ( -OH ) in DMAE ain’t that reactive. Fatty alcohols and glycerin have one.

L-Ascorbyl 2-Phosphate 6-Palmitate Sodium has a lactone group (the ring with the -O- )

http://www.sdk.co.jp/english/products/110/114/12696.html

Lactones may react with ethanolic ammonia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lactone#Reactions
I don’t know whether the amino group from DMAE will react too, but to be safe, that’s another reason to have DMAE in salt form.

You can try keeping some concentrated DMAE + Apprecier solution warm for several days to see if a precipitate, or any other visible change forms.

Beyond that you’ll need 6-figure lab equipment to check for cross-reactions.
HPLC to look for diminished DMAE/Apprecier concentrations, and GC-MS, NMR to look for new chemical bonds from cross reactions.

[Gunther]

@Belassi this patent implies that it should become solid
as it doesn’t make sense to pass a liquid trough a mill:

Preparation of the Gel Network Pre-Mix

To prepare the gel network pre-mix, the water is heated to about 74 °C and the fatty alcohol and secondary surfactant (e.g. Sodium Laureth Sulfate) are added to it. After incorporation, this mixture is passed through a mill and heat exchanger where it is cooled to about 32°C. As a result of this cooling step, the fatty alcohol, the secondary surfactant, and the water form a crystalline gel Network

Gel Network Pre-Mix Example

Table of Gel Network Premix Example

https://patents.google.com/patent/WO2013052802A2/en

[Gunther]

Is that a DIY formula you read on a nonscientific blog?

It’s full of chemical mistakes:

 1 Glycerin is water soluble, not oil soluble AFAIK (I might be wrong, so please check it out yourself)

 2 Sodium bicarbonate is definitely not oil soluble. Besides it likely rises pH = irritating to skin.

 3 While propylene glycol is a bit oil soluble, and not irritating,
Why these “green” bloggers chose a synthetic chemical along vegetable oil.

 4 The formula is extremely oily.
(I admit I’m biased against anything oily, greasy or sticky)
It’ll take forever to dry and likely stain shirts in the process.
I don’t think propylene glycol will speed up drying much.

 5 You can’t react bicarbonate with citric or any acid = you’ll no longer have bicarbonate, it reacts to sodium citrate + CO2 + water I believe
CO2 will create bubbles and water will separate from oil, or at least become hazy.

 Water-based bicarbonate deodorant formulas look intereting. Like this one

https://patents.google.com/patent/US4534962

[Gunther]

These sample formulations from Kao
add SLES and Behentrimonium Chloride in the same recipe seemingly without any problems and passed stability tests (1 month 40ºC/RT/5ºC)

I wonder if other ingredients (like laureth carboxylates) play a role in their stability, besides CAPB/hydroxysultaine order of addition?

PEARLED SHAMPOO

MILD CONDITIONING

RECOMMENDED OPERATIVE METHOD

• Add to the deionized water each component, keeping the abovementioned order and stirring
after each addition until total homogeneity.  

AKYPO SOFT 100 BVC (Sodium Laureth-11 Carboxylate) 4.0%
EMAL® 227E Sodium Laureth Sulfate 25.0%
BETADET S-20 Lauryl Hydroxysultaine 5.0%
LEVENOL H&B Glycereth - 2 Cocoate 2.0%
AMIDET A 15 Trideceth-2 Carboxamide MEA 1.0%

Disperse QUARTAMIN AB in part of the water (10%) at 65ºC, and add it to the rest of the
formulation. By doing this it is not necessary to heat the entire product.
QUARTAMIN Behentrimonium Chloride AB 0.5 %
http://www.kaochemicals-eu.com/sites/default/files/formulations/C-142.pdf

---

CONDITIONING SHAMPOO

Transparent

RECOMMENDED OPERATIVE METHOD
Heat the water up to 70ºC and add the following ingredients: BETADET® HR, QUARTAMIN®
AB,
polyquaternium-10 and polyquaternium-7 and then stir until complete homogenization

BETADET HR  Cocomidopropyl Betaine 8.3%
QUARTAMIN AB   Behentrimonium Chloride 0.6%
Polyquaternium-7 1.1%
Polyquaternium-10 0.4%

Cool down the temperature until 40-35ºC.
Add each one of the remaining ingredients, EMAL®
270D, AKYPO® RLM 45CA, AMIDET® N and
KAO®
SOFCARE GP-1 and stir until complete homogenization after each addition
EMAL 270D Sodium Laureth Sulfate 16.4%
AKYPO RLM 45CA  Laureth-6 Carboxylic Acid 4.2%
AMIDET N  PEG-4 Rapeseedamide 1.5%
KAO SOFCARE GP-1  PPG-3 Caprylyl Ether 0.6%
Add the other additives…
http://www.kaochemicals-eu.com/sites/default/files/formulations/c-244.pdf

[Gunther]

Agree. Weird concentrations were used in the study.

But it kind of proves that cationic surfactants can be made to work with anionic ones.

 Do you know if Behentrimonium, either as Chloride or as Methosulfate, can be made to work with SLES/SLS?

This chinese patent claims they used them both and it passed stability tests (too bad the stability test tables are in chinese)

https://patents.google.com/patent/CN103735430A/en

[Gunther]

Maybe they list the preservatives that along all the the separate ingredients?
At least the formulating dept took the effort to ask all the suppliers and list them. Even more overtime that needs to be covered by the $8 /2 oz price.

[Gunther]

2% gel-network = 0.24% total fatty acids in the shampoo

I wonder if gel-networks are the main “secret” behind the hard-to-replicate conditioning effect of big-name products:

LGNs are important because MOST oil-in-water skin-care emulsions sold globally are based on LGNs stabilized with polymers. MOST hair conditioners sold globally are also based on LGNs. The peroxide phase of many two-part hair-dye formulations and many cream depilatories and hair relaxers are also LGN-based.
https://knowledge.ulprospector.com/4712/pcc-lamellar-gel-network-technology-a-primer/
The word ‘most’ is the key here.

… Under the right conditions, these mixtures have been found to form lamellar crystal mesophases and gel networks that can greatly increase viscosity by converting the micellar structure into the lamellar one capable of forming vesicles and, at the same time, confer stability upon emulsions…
https://books.google.com.ua/books?id=FAYNAwAAQBAJ&pg=PA565&lpg=PA565&dq=“cetyl+alcohol”+lamellar+gel+network+shampoo&source=bl&ots=sttMizm2cK&sig=XSIJNnab1Qn_WHBtMqFDylKOwD8&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwifu7bjyKHbAhUHJVAKHYT-BFY4ChDoAQgxMAI#v=onepage&q=”cetyl%20alcohol”%20lamellar%20gel%20network%20shampoo&f=false
(Sorry for the long link. I don’t know how to make it shorter, yet still redirecting to the same page in the book).

This one touts gel networks as THE key ingredient:
…Similar to the function of coacervates in shampoo, lamellar gel network in conditioner is the key factor for the slippery and smooth feel of wet hair…
https://books.google.com.ua/books?id=HGp_CwAAQBAJ&pg=PA606&lpg=PA606&dq=lamellar+gel+network+shampoo&source=bl&ots=DW-VCYytJP&sig=4q8NPzeDp5y3Q98WBnI4RrjsMcg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwin2NyJ0aHbAhXQfFAKHVu7DbMQ6AEIZDAN#v=onepage&q=lamellar%20gel%20network%20shampoo&f=false

This one says that fatty alcohols are THE most deposited ingredient by conditioners.
It also mentions a strictly controlled heating and cooling process to make the gel network:
…The process starts as an emulsion of the surfactants and alcohols in water. The materials then go trough a strictly controlled heating and cooling process: the application of heat causes the solid compounds to melt, and the solidification process enables a setting of the lamellar assembly molecules in a fully extended conformation, creating a lamellar gel network. When this networks interacts with the hair surface, the high concentration of fatty alcohols make it the most deposited ingredient group, followed by the silicones and cationic surfactants. Typical deposition levels for cationic surfactant, fatty alcohol and silicone are around 500-800, 1000-2000, and 200 ppm, respectively. Typical concentrations are approximately 2-5, 5-10, and 1-10 wt%, respectively…
https://books.google.com.ua/books?id=IaNtd8VwWNQC&pg=PA15&lpg=PA15&dq=lamellar+gel+network+shampoo&source=bl&ots=ODjH1HfujO&sig=roakteBRFWz0l1iEdWObxzg0u-U&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj8kf6o0aHbAhUGbFAKHTr7Be04ChDoAQglMAA#v=onepage&q=lamellar%20gel%20network%20shampoo&f=false

These articles/books also say that cationic surfactant deposition works better when there are lamellar gel networks.

[Gunther]

Bloom shampoo - 2 oz

Ingredients:  Water (Aqua), Sodium C14-16 Olefin Sulfonate, Cocamidopropyl Betaine, Sodium Lauroyl Methyl Isethionate, Cocamidopropyl Hydroxysultaine, Theobroma Cacao (Cocoa) Seed Butter, Butyrospermum Parkii (Shea Butter), Passiflora Incarnata Seed Oil, Passiflora Edulis Seed Oil, Helianthus Annuus (Sunflower) Seed Extract, Arctium Majus Root (Burdock Root) Extract, Panthenol, Hexapeptide-11, Equisetum Arvense (Horsetail) Extract, Citrus Medica Limonum (Lemon) Peel Extract, Camellia Sinensis Leaf Extract, Citrus Limon (Lemon) Fruit Extract, Malva Sylvestris (Mallow) Flower Extract, Pyrus Malus (Apple) Fruit Extract, Saccharum Officinarum (Sugar Cane) Extract, Dipropylene Glycol, Glycol Distearate, Hexylene Glycol, Hydrogenated Castor Oil/ Sebacic Acid Copolymer, PEG-200, Hydrogenated Glyceryl Palmate, Hydroxypropyl Guar Hydroxypropyltrimonium Chloride, PEG-7 Glyceryl Cocoate, Polyquaternium-7, Silicone Quaternium-16, Polyquaternium-70, Citric Acid, Hydroxyethyl Behenamidopropyl Dimonium Chloride, PEG-150 Distearate, Acrylates Copolymer, Betaine, Butylene Glycol, Butyloctanol, C30-45 Alkyl Dimethicone, Cocamide MIPA, Butyloctanol, C30-45 Alkyl Dimethicone, Cocamide MIPA, Cystine Bis-PG-Propyl Silanetriol, Disodium EDTA, Ethylhexylglycerin, Ozokerite, Phenoxyethanol, Phenyl Trimethicone, Sodium Hydroxide, Sodium Laneth-40 Maleate/Styrene Sulfonate Copolymer, Undeceth-11, Undeceth-5, Methylchloroisothiazolinone,Methylisothiazolinone, Fragrance (Parfum), Yellow 5 (CI 19140), Red 33 (CI 17200)

http://livonlife.com/product/bloom-shampoo-2-oz/

56 ingredients
most of them useless or potentially destabilizing
and found in tiny amounts. My guess is that the 1% line is at or just after Cocamidopropyl Hydroxysultaine (as it also has CAPB before).

2 oz for $8!
Well, I guess they have pay sourcing dept overtime somehow.

Sorry for bumping an old thread, just couldn’t resist.

[Gunther]

The other study advises to cool it off slowly,
to better form the network
so it doesn’t hurt to try it that way.

For dissolving it in water,
for every 19.17 g of the gel-network, add 30.83 mL of water
in order to get a 50% mix in the final shampoo.
If it doesn’t dissolve by tomorrow with occasional stirring, it’s likely going to need a high shear blender.

@Perry are these ones the same thing as lamellar gel networks?
https://knowledge.ulprospector.com/4712/pcc-lamellar-gel-network-technology-a-primer/

[Gunther]

@Belassi there are 2 studies and 1 patent
all with slightly different percentages, which one are you talking about?

for the study where they used SLES:

Gel network shampoo formulation and hair health benefits
Shampoo formulation
The gel network was made with 11% of SLES1S surfactant, 8% stearyl alcohol and 4% cetyl alcohol and 77% deionized water where all ingredients were first heated together to a temperature between 75 and 90 C and then cooled to room temperature. This process formed the gel-premix.
A small amount of this pre-mix, 2.3% fatty alcohol by weight of the final shampoo, was then dispersed in a typical shampoo containing other benefit agents such as surfactants, silicones and polymers.
https://www.deepdyve.com/lp/wiley/gel-network-shampoo-formulation-and-hair-health-benefits-pQODAsekXo
(you can preview the full study there for 5 minutes for free, or register for a free-trial, credit card required but not charged after the free-trial expires)

It says 11%, but I don’t think 12% you used is going to change the end result
You can also fine tune by checking the stearyl/cetyl alcohol ratio in the cetearyl-alcohol batch that you have, adding a bit extra cetyl-alcohol as required to perfectly match the 8%/4% used in the study.
Although I don’t think it’s going to make it any different.

Now they added 2.3% total fatty alcohols in the shampoo, not 2.3% of the gel network.
So, if the gel network has 12% fatty alcohols in it ( 8% stearyl + 4% cetyl)
you need:
2.3 / 0.12 = 19.17% gel-network in the shampoo in order to get 2.3% total fatty alcohols from it.

As to verify if calculations are correct: 
19.17% gel-network multiplied by 12% of it are fatty alcohols = 2.3% total fatty alcohols in the shampoo.
(you can always use less of it, as they usually use high amounts in studies, so effects are clearly seen. i.e. you can use only 1% or 0.5% total fatty acids in the shampoo, as many recipes already do).

This 19.17% gel-network has 11% of SLES on it
so it’s adding 2.11% SLES to the shampoo.

For comparison, you can just mix all shampoo ingredients together, without making the gel-network first
(make sure to add the 2.11 SLES previously mentioned)
but we probably know the end result in advance = undissolved fatty alcohols.

Again, you can preview the full study for 5 minutes for free at deepdvye.com

[Gunther]

While cetyl alcohol + surfactant -only  can be used
fatty alcohol mixtures yield more stable gels

Colloidal Gels Formed by Dilute Aqueous Dispersions of Surfactant and Fatty Alcohol

…The SDS/CA/water system was chosen to keep the model as simple as possible although it is well known that mixtures of fatty alcohols, for example, of CA and stearyl alcohol (SA), yield more stable gels…

…A chain length mismatch of the alcohol molecules as in the commonly used mixtures of cetyl and stearyl alcohol helps to prevent crystallization…
 https://www.springer.com/cda/content/document/cda_downloaddocument/9783319151281-c2.pdf?SGWID=0-0-45-1504288-p177222117

So, yes
you can use a cetyl + cetearyl alcohol mix to match the cetyl+stearyl percentages used in the study, as @Belassi just suggested.

By the way, in this study they used
Sodium dodecyl sulfate = Sodium lauryl sulfate = SLS
instead of SLES

[Gunther]

PVP is a good all-around syling gel ingredient

the main downside is that being water soluble it becomes sticky under humid conditions, although this solubility also makes it easy to wash off, unlike VA.

[Gunther]

In the first study

Gel network shampoo formulation and hair health benefits.

Marsh JM1, Brown MA2, Felts TJ1, Hutton HD2, Vatter ML1, Whitaker S1, Wireko FC1, Styczynski PB1, Li C1, Henry ID1.

Abstract

OBJECTIVE:

The objective of this work was to create a shampoo formula that contains a stable ordered gel network structure that delivers fatty alcohols inside hair.

METHODS:

X-ray diffraction (SAXS and WAXS), SEM and DSC have been used to confirm formation of the ordered Lβ gel network with fatty alcohol (cetyl and stearyl alcohols) and an anionic surfactant (SLE1S). Micro-autoradiography and extraction methods using GC-MS were used to confirm penetration of fatty alcohols into hair, and cyclic fatigue testing was used to measure hair strength.

RESULTS:

In this work, evidence of a stable Lβ ordered gel network structure created from cetyl and stearyl alcohols and anionic surfactant (SLE1S) is presented, and this is confirmed via scanning electron microscopy images showing lamella layers and differential scanning calorimetry (DSC) showing new melting peaks vs the starting fatty alcohols. Hair washed for 16 repeat cycles with this shampoo showed penetration of fatty alcohols from the gel network into hair as confirmed by a differential extraction method with GC-MS and by radiolabelling of stearyl alcohol and showing its presence inside hair cross-sections. The gel network role in delivering fatty alcohol inside hair is demonstrated by comparing with a shampoo with added fatty alcohol not in an ordered gel network structure. The hair containing fatty alcohol was measured via the Dia-stron cyclic fatigue instrument and showed a significantly higher number of cycles to break vs control.

CONCLUSIONS:

The formation of a stable gel network was confirmed in the formulated shampoo, and it was demonstrated that this gel network is important to deliver cetyl and stearyl alcohols into hair. The presence of fatty alcohol inside hair was shown to deliver a hair strength benefit via cyclic fatigue testing.

© 2017 Society of Cosmetic Scientists and the Société Française de Cosmétologie.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28594472
Free preview at:
https://www.deepdyve.com/lp/wiley/gel-network-shampoo-formulation-and-hair-health-benefits-pQODAsekXo?key=bioportfolio

By SLES1S I guess they meant SLES 1 Ethylene Oxide mol, didn’t they?

They first mixed and heated just some (not all) of the SLES with stearyl and cetyl alcohol to allow for the gel-network to form itself, allow to cool off  
and only then, all other shampoo ingredients were added:

Shampoo formulation
The gel network was made with 11% of SLES1S surfactant, 8% stearyl alcohol and 4% cetyl alcohol and 77% deionized water where all ingredients were first heated together to a temperature between 75 and 90 C and then cooled to room temperature. This process formed the gel-premix.
A small amount of this pre-mix, 2.3% fatty alcohol by weight of the final shampoo, was then dispersed in a typical shampoo containing other benefit agents such as surfactants, silicones and polymers.
https://www.deepdyve.com/lp/wiley/gel-network-shampoo-formulation-and-hair-health-benefits-pQODAsekXo

It certainly looks interesting and worth trying, even though 2.3% would normally seem like a lot in a shampoo without gel networks.

Also interesting to try SLES + dimethiconol since the latter has some -OH groups, although two of them one on each side, and with a silicon chain, instead of carbon like fatty alcohols.

[Gunther]

Any naturally preservative that you guys and girls can think of
as long as it’s found in plants (animals is mostly taboo)
that can be extracted and purified by simple methods like pressing or heating
and by simple extractions with water or alcohol (then evaporating the solvent if needed)?

@Christopher I agree that ethanol is far from ideal a preservative.
On The Other Hand extracting Benzyl alcohol from essential oils looks interesting. Even if you ain’t able to totally purify it, additional compounds may help as natural fragrances.

Natural occurrences

Benzyl alcohol is produced naturally by many plants and is commonly found in fruits and teas. It is also found in a variety of essential oilsincluding jasmine, hyacinth, and ylang-ylang

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benzyl_alcohol#Natural_occurrences

@Belassi  it looks like sticking to coconut oil and KOH seems the best way to ensure solubility.

While you can’t find bare Lauric, Myristic or Oleic acid in vegetable oils, I wonder if you can saponify their oils then wait for the insoluble ones to precipitate, without needing a centrifuge.

Summary

Solubility data are provided and collected for the pure sodium and potassium soaps. Hydrolysis obscures the temperatures of solution but is obviated by the presence of a small excess of alkali. Each sodium soap has a large range of temperature between fair and high solubility, whereas the potassium soaps go abruptly into solution, at almost the same temperature and concentration of each soap.

The only soaps that are even moderately soluble at room temperature are potassium laurate, myristate, and oleate, the potassium salt of acids from coconut oil, and the sodium oleate. The other sodium and potassium soaps of the saturated fatty acids require elevated temperatures for solution.

Phase diagrams for the five commonest potassium soaps are developed and recorded.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/BF02645899

[Gunther]

@Perry I totally agree that centuries-old shampoo recipes are still man-made
it’s just customers preference for old methods perceived as less chemically intensive.
(customers and management erk when I say that opium is 100% natural, but not any good for you, even if you cut it with a natural stone or wood piece to preserve stone-age methods, so I just muted the natural vs man-made endless debate)

@Belassi I agree that saponified shampoo doesn’t work nearly as well as synthetic ones, although still acceptable as body wash.

Several challenges ahead
1 How to get saponified soaps to properly dissolve
starting with coconut oil and KOH seems to be a start:
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/BF02645899

2 How to get a 100% natural acid to lower pH without chemically intensive methods (like citric acid from fruits or lactic acid from yogurt)

3 How to get saponified soaps to remain soluble despite lowered pH.

4 100% natural thickeners

5 100% natural preservatives.
Any suggestions for 1-5?

Natural shampoo/bodywash is just one of many projects, synthetic ones are already underway.

[Gunther]

100% natural preservatives are hard to figure out
please let us know if you find one

We are developing a 100% natural shampoo and body wash line
based on vegetable oils saponified with KOH from burnt wood

100% natural preservatives got us stuck
I proposed Ethyl alcohol as the main preservative, sterile filtering liquid ingredients to reduce bacteria.

As secondary preservatives We’re currently considering some other vegetable oil with mild antiseptic activity, and physically processing lemon juice to get citric acid from it without chemicals.
We almost gave up with processing yogurt to get lactic acid to lower pH.