Chemist77
Forum Replies Created
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Maybe a little water soluble silicone, those ones you mentioned wouldn’t impart any shine once dried. Or ethoxylated esters like ethoxylated jojoba esters.
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Thanks @Sibech, that is an interesting observation.
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@RenKB the HPMC is foam modifier, HEC just thickens the aqueous based solutions. And lastly, @ngarayeva001 might be right if the knock outs ain’t bringing in the change.
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@Doreen think they took care of loose ends I mean the double bonds where they don’t cleavage and it stays as it is for longer time. Once the double bonds are attacked, you have rancid smell and many other undesired properties.
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Did u knock out HEC and check if that’s the culprit.
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It’s surprising knowing that Schulke does Koko test and which runs for 6 weeks AFAIK. Our support lab does a 4 CC test and so comparatively its more stringent. That list has nothing that can support preservation except Dissolvine chelant which boosts the preservative efficacy. Why don’t you contact S&M and send the LOI to them to let them know if there has been a slip during testing. I might be wrong here but honestly I don’t see anything which can protect the formula from a KOKO test.
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Completely agree with @ozgirl, I mean its always manageable with either LABSA neutralzation or alkali. Generally pH drop brings in milky appearance in my dish wash and alkali troubleshoots it.
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Gunther even if the pH shoots up, the back acid neutralisation brings it back under control. Honestly you need to switch the supplier here. The LABSA you are using is probably a batch full of problematic impurities.
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Haroon your ingredients are way off the chart. LABSA is 10%, SLES is 8-12, NaOH pure is 1-2% (depending on final pH) If needed, CDEA 1-2%, Cocamidopropylbetaine around 3%. Where is your preservative? Fragrance and finally sodium chloride to adjust the viscosity.
NEXT TIME POST YOUR FORMULA IN PERCENTAGE, else no one would give a hoot about what you posted.Good luck
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What are you putting in that formula apart from water (correct me I am wrong)
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Gunther did you check the pH when the solution is milky. IDK but maybe you need more alkali there for complete neutralization. There is no fixed ratio for such neutralizations and this is what I have learnt in lab. Everytime such reactions need a final pH adjustments.
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Post a new discussion @haroon. You just can’t post anywhere and expect people to respond. Read the rules to have a better understanding about this platform. And don’t forget to post what and how much you added in that formula.
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@Gunther I generally use 96% LABSA and never had any kind of precipate falling out. In fact it goes into water easily and then I would adjust the pH at the end of the process. Of course I do have other surfactants in between. If you want I can pm you the formulation we use and which sells pretty much good in my region. But again I would say that there is something wrong with your LABSA I suppose. Can you arrange a fresh small sample from your supplier and do a lab trial. The starting process is same as you have mentioned in your post.
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Gunther what exactly are your trying to do here??? Making the neutralized salt or doing a finished product. I can share my dish wash liquid experience where I am doing the neutralization in-situ and adjust the final pH as per the benchmark. I never had any precipitation in such dishwash liquids and I don’t use any hydrotropes as well.
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I have a pre-blend of potassium cocoate, cocamide MEA and sodium citrate. I use it for my soap based hand wash liquid mixed with other surfactants and the product is great. No issues of maintaining a higher pH too, i keep it under 8 and the product as such is pretty much stable.
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You could use some water soluble silicones or silicone-surfactant emulsions. As @Perry said, 2% is sheer waste and you could do with 0.1% also since it is a rinse off product.
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If you can access Lubrizol site, they have some very good starting formulas based on fatty acid hand wash soaps like lifebuoy (not shampoos). You can then try replacing some NaOH/KOH with TEA there. You need a robust system to provide stability to this kind of soap/surfactant system.
Good luck. -
@Fekher aggression won’t get you any advice or respect on this platform. I suppose @ngarayeva001 has put it very nicely for you and for all of us who think that we are the smartest among the crowd. We share ideas here, forcing those on members isn’t the concept of this set up. No one is mocking you or your ability but the way you come across with your hard and fast attitude, it drives people to sometimes come up with those explanations. Surely you are a champ in your work place but this is an ocean of experts and I have not seen a single respected member boasting of his/her abilities and strengths on this platform. You post, you listen, you read and then you either agree or disagree. That’s about it and there is no third way here.
Surely you have ideas and we all can read them here but avoid ‘Mr. Know all’ attitude. -
well Galaxy have a manufacturing plant in Egypt so that should be easy for you. If at all it works out for you!!
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Mount Stupid, wow what an explanation.
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Not sure where you are located but Galaxy Surfactants have such ready to dilute and fill blends.
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@donburgs if you’re are limited to those ingredients only, did you try to change the percentage of waxes to oils (except the EO).
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Carbomers are not conditioning agents, they are viscosity building polymers. Addition of guar only might give you a viscosity boost possibly but guar HPTC not so much.
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I could throw in some Guar HPTC for conditioning, choice of surfactants is individual and very much cost dependent. But as @Perry said, certain ratios of surfactants can produce a good optimised product in probably less number of trials.
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@Perry here the issue is change in spray pattern from the nozzle. Because of the cohesive property of this polymer, the spray properties are absolutely undesirable.