[Abdullah]

@”DRBOB@VERDIENT.BIZ” which one is stronger? gluconolactone or citric acid? 

[Abdullah]

@LincsChemist interesting.
Can it be because i am using tetrasodium EDTA?

Btw i have some BTMS 25 and SPDMA. I will check with these two 
Thanks ????

[Abdullah]

jemolian said:

If you sell to stores, it would be good to communicate to the retailers well. Providing them with product knowledge, sufficient marketing materials, etc, would be useful in selling the products.  

Although Currently we are more focusing in wholesalers. I will keep in mind that end customer is purchasing from retailers and they should have enough knowledge and support.
Thanks ????

[Abdullah]

@Microformulation good tips especially the 2nd one.
Thanks

[Abdullah]

@Perry thanks

[Abdullah]

Perry said:

An excellent book I’d suggest is Will It Fly by Pat Flynn.
Another one is the $100 Startup by Chris Guillebeau.
Finally, Ready Fire Aim by Michael Masterson

These two will help you figure out if you have an idea that is any good.  

Thanks for the books. 
From these 3 books, Which two will help figure out if we we have an idea that is any good? 

Sure they can buy other things that solve the same problem but if they like you, they’ll buy from you.

This is a good point. I will start campaigns in facebook just for the purpose of making people love our company. 

[Abdullah]

Pattsi said:

I believe most of startup want to start with online sale so public relation and communication is an important key.

I bought seasonal gifts for my friends from 2 stores.
The 2nd store is very attentive, they e-mail me to check if the order is right and everything. So I have better experience with the 2nd store.   

Good point about after sale communication. ????????

we sell to stores and our customers purchase from stores.They communicate with shopkeeper and we are not in direct communication with consumer.

We will add the phone number on label the next time we were printing label’s so consumer would be able to directly communicate with us if necessary.

[Abdullah]

I have experienced that the quality of our products change and improve very often. The product we make now has much better quality than same product from last year. If a customer has purchased our product last year and didn’t like it, they may like it if they purchase it now. But they won’t purchase what they didn’t like again because we know the quality has changed and improved but they dont know that. So it work better to after some time make another company by another name and sell our products in both although actual product is the same.

This trick worked well for me.

I think that was the reason for big companies like p&g that started many sub companies that sell the same product for example Shampoo.

[Abdullah]

Over conditioning also makes your hair feel bad and in your formula i think it is cover conditioning. 
As perry said start with

%2 BTMS
%2 cetyl alcohol or more for viscosity
%1 dimethicone
Fragrance
Preservative
And see how this fees

Btw what viscosity dimethicone are you using?

[Abdullah]

@Pharma thanks

[Abdullah]

@Pharma i wanted to add ethyl Lauroyl Arginate HCl and EDTA in lotion both for preserving the product. They also formed salt as photo. 
Does it mean they dont help the preservative system anymore? 

[Abdullah]

Also SLES

[Abdullah]

Increase Glutamate to at least %40 and decrease glucoside to max %4 the problem will be solved. 

Do you have preservative? 

[Abdullah]

@Pharma does it mean it is not compatible with cationics? 

[Abdullah]

@Pharma thanks

[Abdullah]

@”Dr Catherine Pratt” have a look at this

[Abdullah]

@RedCoast thanks ????

[Abdullah]

ozgirl said:

I haven’t tried cetyl esters so I can’t really comment on that.

Polyquaternium 10 might add some additional benefits that BTMS doesn’t but you should just try it with and without Polyquaternium-10 and see if there is a perceivable difference.

May I ask what additional benefits pg10 has over BTMS?

[Abdullah]

They already told you. %0.1 EHG with % 0.9 phenoxyethanol

[Abdullah]

@ozgirl the pH was between 4-5 for both before mixing and i didn’t note what it was after mixing but it wasn’t very high or low

[Abdullah]

@Pharma that is cool ????.

So is biodegradability the only problem with EDTA or it has any negative effect for consumer too like irritation or when absorbed from leave on product, when used at %0.1-0.2?

[Abdullah]

@Perry thanks. 

[Abdullah]

For your formula, i would suggest remove the soap, reduce eo to %0.3, CAPB to %5 and increase the Sulfoacetate to make the total active surfactant around%10. 

For eczema, i have it too. And there are 3 treatments for it that i know and have used.

1. Steroids

2. Suppressor of your immune system
3. Petrolatum

The one with least side effect is petrolatum according to my knowledge and experience.

[Abdullah]

@Pharma that was a wonderful explanation ????. I will not think of citrate as an alternative to EDTA anymore.

Another question:
If Cu, Fe and Mn are the metals of concern in cosmetic, according to the chart above EDTA is a lot more stronger than GLDA but the chart below shows GLDA functions better than EDTA at same quantity. Any thoughts on this?
The chart below is from supplier. 

[Abdullah]

@Pharma thanks a lot