[Abdullah]

When i make samples, i only keep 30-40g as sample and use the rest of it.

[Abdullah]

CAPB+ APG will remove too much lipids and babies skin produce much less lipids than adults. So drying is a big concern for mildness.

[Abdullah]

Instead of xanthan+ mpg, i suggest guar gum or HPMC. 
They will not need mpg so cost less and less negative effect on foam and viscosity.

[Abdullah]

https://www.lorealparisusa.com/brands/loreal-kids

[Abdullah]

Fekher said:

@Paprik I supposed that MPG  is know ???? and yes it is monopropylen glycol then is it compatible using pq7 in presence of xanthan gum? 
 @Abdullah Sure we have SLES however I will not use it for baby’s shampoo. (accessible “mild” T. A) 

What is the function of mpg? 

SLES: CAPB is less drying than CAPB alone or CAPB: APG. 

L’oreal is using SLES in all baby shampoos. So it should be gentle enough.

[Abdullah]

Yes. Use 1%, lower the pH to ≥4 and add some sodium benzoate and a chelating agent if it is compatible with honeyquat 

[Abdullah]

@ketchito if BTMC has antimicrobial effects, against which microorganisms is it effective? 

Do you know it’s MIC? 

[Abdullah]

ketchito said:

@Abdullah If you’re refering to ref 6 of the Annex III, that one is for sodium and potassium chlorate which are different than sodium and potassium chloride. There is no restriction for the level of sodium chloride in a cosmetic formula (except for the chemical ones).

Yeah 
My mistake 
Thanks

[Abdullah]

Fekher said:

@Abdullah @Paprik because listed ingredients are accessible however others not sure however what in put you can suggest for baby’s shampoo for the level

 CABB 16%
Coco glucoside 4%
Xanthan gum 0,5%
MPG 4%
Perfume
Preservative 
Water Qsp

  I will try this as start and depends on result may I will change the level of my T. A . 

Do you mean SLES is not accessable? 

What is mpg? 

[Abdullah]

Change the preservative, or add an anti fungal or reduce the pH to 4

[Abdullah]

@ketchito @MariaSibon in ref 6 the upper limit for sodium chloride is 3%. Does it mean we should not use more than 3% NACL in shampoo or face wash? 

[Abdullah]

Agree with @Paprik 

Use an anionic surfactant and Guar Hydroxypropyltrimonium chloride.

Without anionic surfactant, removing of cationic polymer would be difficult. 

[Abdullah]

evchem2 said:

comments above make sense to me. On an unrelated note, how do you incorporate both xanthan and cationic guar? Are you worried about any long term instability since you have both anionic and cationic polymer in your formulation?

I have samples from more than a year ago with no problem.  

I add guar first and xanthan last before NACL. 

[Abdullah]

ketchito said:

@Abdullah 10 people seems like a small number to draw conclusions, especially if part of the group liked formula A, and the other part liked formula B. You could even find this happening if you ask them to evaluate the same formula but with different codes. Are they trained panelists? (trained panelists are constantly trained, evaluated and even “calibrated”).

Some shampoo bars use Stearic acid which can actually deposit on hair in small amounts (I’ve seen that even with fabric softeners), so theoretically it could happen that your stearate is occupying a place where Amodimethicone was supposed to take. Nevertheless, in shampoos, EGMS is already in solid form (flat sheets of EGMS suspended in the product when used as a pearlizer), which reduced it’s chances of deposition.

Thanks
Yes the number is small and not reliable but that is what i can do right now. 

[Abdullah]

CzarXavier said:

Abdullah said:

For viscosity, remove EDTA and reduce fatty alcohols.

I live in AZ which has notoriously bad hard water. Wouldn’t I want to keep the EDTA in this case? 

This is a cationic product. I don’t think hard water will be an issue but you should use filtered water anyway and that is not so hard water. 

In my experience EDTA increase the viscosity of BTMS a lot.

[Abdullah]

@Pharma @PhilGeis thanks a lot. 

[Abdullah]

You can use any amount you want but i think 3% SLMI+ 3% CAPB is very enough.

[Abdullah]

For viscosity, remove EDTA and reduce fatty alcohols.

[Abdullah]

@Pharma @PhilGeis thanks 

Here from long time ago people were using viagra commonly without consulting doctor but according to Google search it needs prescription in US. Recently i see that a lot of people here use oral Isotretinoin for their skin smoothness which alsi need prescription in US. I wanted to know if it is ok to use drugs like this without consulting doctor or there is any serious side effects with using these drugs without consulting doctor and maybe for long term. 

[Abdullah]

And how cold does it get?

[Abdullah]

What is your formula?

[Abdullah]

PhilGeis said:

As the objective is to deposit the stuff on the scalp - are you sure you want a solution?

@PhilGeis if it is a leave on scalp product, does it matter if Piroctone Olamine or another active is in solution form? 

[Abdullah]

saeedulfat said:

evchem2 said:

At 5.5 sodium benzoate is mostly in the salt form which is ineffective as a preservative. Agree with other comments on that you need to switch to a different preservation strategy. 

No man the sodium benzoate is 1.25% the ph is 5.5

1.25% sodium benzoate at pH 5.5 gives you 0.05% benzoic acid.
You need at least 0.1% benzoic acid for fungi. 
For bacteria you need much more benzoic acid. 

So sodium benzoate is not enough as preservative at pH 5.5 even if you use 2.5%.

[Abdullah]

What is your formula?

[Abdullah]

If you need to use 2 emulsifiers, i suggest GMS+ GSC or GMS+ Sucrose Stearate.