[sean9980]

If you haven’t neutralized it, that could be the problem as you dont really get much viscosity if its isnt.

[sean9980]

Your problem is it’s collecting water from the atmosphere and becoming hard right? Usually I just close my bag up and close it up. One thing you could do is put it in a room where a dehumidifier is running to reduce the humidity in the room

How big is your bag? Mine is about 25kg

[sean9980]

PhilGeis said:

Nice post Mayday.   I too have had trouble with sorbate and also had little to no issue with phenoxy odor (mine at 5000 ppm or less).
One add - benzoic acid with surfactants can have efficacy well above the indicated pH from pKa.  Can send some documentation
I used this in preservation (with isothiazolinones) for surfactant products face wash, shampoo, hand soaps for many years.

Is it a mostly water based system?

[sean9980]

Well it could be because I have it at 1%, I am making a few samples of 0.50 and .75 and sending it to the lab for the KoKo testing

[sean9980]

Mayday, and what percentage are you using Potassium Sorbate, I haven’t really noticed too much of a smell from the Potassium Sorbate, however I know the smell of the Phenoxyethanol is quite strong. I am going to try 0.5%, have you had a mostly water based system and done PET on it?

[sean9980]

Paprik said:

sean9980 said:

Paprik said:

Also, Phenoxyethanol as a solo preservative is not enough. 

Use Liquid Germall plus, 0.5%, goes straight into water and had never issues. 

You could use euxyl pe 9010

Euxyl PE9010 is 90% Phenoxyethanol, therefore using this won’t solve the original issue. 

Sorry I didn’t read the original post when I was doing the search

[sean9980]

No, the smell is from the Phenoxyethanol, it has a strong smell. I will try making a small batch with 0.5% Euxyl pe 9010 and 0.75% and send it to a lab testing to see if it can hold up

[sean9980]

Paprik said:

Also, Phenoxyethanol as a solo preservative is not enough. 

Use Liquid Germall plus, 0.5%, goes straight into water and had never issues. 

You could use euxyl pe 9010

[sean9980]

@Leo
You have to use water.

[sean9980]

Lower MW have better penetration

[sean9980]

My goal is to dillute the potassium hydroxide enough so that basically I can add the same amount of KOH sol. as I did TEA sol, which was around 200mL for my given product

[sean9980]

@chemicalmatt

Alright so what your saying is you have 40% KOH/60% Water, and then your using it a ratio of 1.4g (solution) per 1g of carbomer? I guess that really depends on what else is in the product too that may be affecting the pH. But in my head that just seems strong.

(6.24) pKb value of Triethanolamine

(0.5) pKb value of KOH

https://www.aatbio.com/data-sets/pka-and-pkb-reference-table

Is there a way I can determine the pKb of a 40% Solutiuon? Does that even make sense?

[sean9980]

A combination of 0.5% ferulic acid (a potent antioxidant of plant origin) with 15% Vit. C and 1% Vit. E can increase the efficacy of Vit. C eight-fold.[3] It was noted that this triple combination was very useful for the reduction of acute and chronic photodamage, and could be used for prevention of skin cancer in the future.

—-

“Because this form of Vitamin C is easily absorbed and utilized by the skin, it is not associated with the irritation often experienced with L-ascorbic acid. … We use about 10% sodium ascorbyl phosphate which is equivalent to a much higher concentration of L-ascorbic acid because it is much more bioavailable.”

[sean9980]

You need some polysorbate 20 in there if your going to include oils in it tmk, your also not going to put in 20% SAP, thats a bit too much and would prolly cause a lot of irritation, I think max usage is around 8%, the claims online has to do with the (20% Vitamin C bioavailability), SAP is pretty expensive if your buying it from the usa, but pretty cheap, or reasonably cheap from china. Also your batches shouldnt be turning brown, they prolly cheaped out on you and put regular vitamin c in there lol, feurlic acid i think has some sort of patent on it with the regular l-ascorbic acid as it prevents it from breaking down quickly, ive read up on it and i am also planning a vitamin c for commercial distribution

“The present invention relates to single-phase solution compositions of L-ascorbic acid that provide enhanced stability, enhanced solubility and an enhanced photoprotective effect as compared to prior compositions. The single-phase solution compositions comprise by weight 5% to 40% L-ascorbic acid; 0.2% to 5.0% of a cinnamic acid derivative, such as p-coumaric acid, ferulic acid, caffeic acid, sinapinic acid, a derivative thereof, or a combination thereof; 10% to 60% of a solvent comprising a glycol ether and an alkanediol; and water; the composition having a pH of no more than about 3.5. When the cinnamic acid derivative is present at an amount greater than 0.5%, the composition further comprises a surfactant in an amount of 1.5% to 5.0%. The single-phase solution compositions may also comprise a form of Vitamin E and a surfactant, or a form of Vitamin A and a surfactant.”

As you can see its a bit of restricted technology, in that case, anyhow good luck

[sean9980]

Maybe Staphylococcus roseus

[sean9980]

I’ve noticed if I add the Hyaluronic Acid, wait for it to hydrate and then mix it in, it seems to not bunch up. However it gets cloudy, so I tried adding a little glycerin to help clear it up

[sean9980]

Post ingredients and percentages, without a good emulsifier that would happen

[sean9980]

What would you recommend as a paraben/formaldehyde free preservative?

[sean9980]

Alright so it was a 55000g batch, so thats why it looks so large, usually in smaller batches it just looks kinda like a stringy film, that doesnt quite blend in the product. This goo ball formed within the product and sank, I was using a high speed mixer, so I think it pushed it all together… However, even when I was making smaller batches this film like product still existed even after 24 hours. I did NOT add any Hyaluronic Acid to the product before adding the preservative (Optiphen Plus) into it, maybe thats my issue??

1) Measure out 55,000 grams of Water
2) Add Preservative (I originally added 1.25%— but noticed it still does this goo like substance when I added 1%)
3) Use a mixer it looks like this
https://images.homedepot-static.com/productImages/88268c40-b1b2-44bd-85ae-fb495e4ebe9b/svn/hdx-paint-mixers-stirrers-hm5-hdx-64_1000.jpg

(By the way these work really good for mixing gels up)

Then thats when I noticed the giant ball of goo forming

Here is a smaller batch you can see the stringy parts sitting on the top of the water,