[ngarayeva001]

Have a look what Trulux have. It’s Australian supplier. They have very advanced ingredients but prices are a bit outrageous. I know for sure they have polyglyceryl-2 DPHS

[ngarayeva001]

You will never be able to thicken a product full of electrolytes with sodium carbomer (or any other carbomer/acrylic acid based polymer). Remove aloe. What is this product supposed to do in general?

[ngarayeva001]

@Perry, yes it makes sense. For a shampoo SLES is the ‘active’ ingredients. And actually you listed zinc oxide, which can be argued is the best anti-aging ingredient as most of aging comes from the sun (and UVA in particular). Just curious what is you opinion of retinol as brightening and anti-aging ingredient? I am not referring to retinoids as a general class but the ingredient with INCI retinol.

[ngarayeva001]

I went into a hustle of getting hydroquinone through friends in Russia (because where else you get such an ingredient in DIY quantity), passivating steel I was using for making a product and multiple trials and errors to stabilise the emulsion (ph, different antioxidants etc)… and wasn’t impressed at all. I used 2% Hydroquinone lotion s
from November to February  (very little sun in London during this time). I want to hope that it’s not because hydroquinone is not an impressive ingredient but because I am  not a good formulator (although I took dupont’s formula as a starting point).

[ngarayeva001]

https://www.glamourcosmetics.it/gb/isolan-gps

[ngarayeva001]

@Graillotion, have a look if you can order from here
https://www.glamourcosmetics.it/it/
It’s probably the best of all DIY suppliers. They have very advanced materials that others don’t and the range is huge. You can use translate in google chrome to navigate (I don’t know a single world in Italian but navigate it).

[ngarayeva001]

@Perry, it’s impossible to disagree with your list (although I didn’t know GMS is a pearliser) but those are functional ingredients. It would be great to know if there are active ingredient that work as advertised in your opinion. I know if it does something beyond ‘improving appearance’ it’s OTC, but nevertheless is there an active ingredient that doesn’t cause skepticism?

[ngarayeva001]

Sorry just to emphasize it even more, I have the least sensitive skin among everyone I know. Most people won’t be able to tolerate what I can when it comes to pH. Be very careful with acids.

[ngarayeva001]

I think it’s my duty to warn everyone about using such templates. The math might be right but pH is extremely complex thing. This calc works on paper, but other ingredients might have significant  influence on the overall system. Acids must be treated with respect. I use this template to make acid peels for my personal use but I would never share it with anyone else. I am sure people with more experience would support me on this.

[ngarayeva001]

@czkld may I ask where did you find yours?

[ngarayeva001]

I read that paper (not independent) on 4% niacinamide +2% NAG. Made it, used for three months. No skin brightening noticed. I think however that niacinamide (in its own)reduces appearance of pores. 

[ngarayeva001]

To be honest I would rather have hard water as a popular trend than not using proper preservatives and vilifying silicones.

[ngarayeva001]

Not the most scientific way but for the lack of something better: polysorbate 80 has high HLB and very “water-like”. Obviously it doesn’t want to mix with oils and sinks in the bottom of the beaker (I was making oil to emulsion makeup remover). However, there are some oils with which it forms a clear solution (even after many months). I couldn’t find a comprehensive table of polarities but I noticed in BASFs emollient tables that the oils that mix with polysorbate 80 are highlighted as “high polarity”. Those are (from my experiments) c/c triglycerides, octyldodecanol and c12-15 alkyl benzoate. Also, my very first w/o experiments were separating although I did everything else right (I was using alkyl benzoate and octyldodecanol). They stopped separating when I switched to isododecane, IPM and some other emollients that were classified as esters with medium polarity by BASFs table.
http://www.eurotradingonline.it/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Emollient-spreadsheet-.pdf
I checked all the cosmetic chemistry books that I have but there are not polarity tables there. All you get is “non-polar oils form more stable emulsions”

[ngarayeva001]

https://www.happi.com/issues/2014-11-02/view_formulator-forum/how-to-select-emollients-for-stable-emulsions/
useful article on the stability of emulsions.

[ngarayeva001]

Oil (CTFA Name)	Polarity Index [mN/m]
Isoparaffin (C12-C14)	53.0
Squalan ®	46.2
Hydrogenated polyisobutene (Luvitol Lite ®)	44.7
Isohexadecane (ARLAMOL ® ND)	43.8
Isohexadecane	43.8
Mineral oil (Paraffin oil perliquidum)	43.7
Mineral oil	43.7
Isoeicosane	41.9
Dioctylcyclohexane	39.0
Mineral oil (Paraffin oil subliquidum)	38.3
Dicaprylyl carbonate	31.7
Dicaprylyl ether	30.9
Dihexyl carbonate	30.9
Cetystearyl octanoate	28.6
Passiflora Incarnata Oil (Cegesoft ® PFO)	27.2
Oleyl Erucate (Cetiol J600 ®)	27.1
Dimethicone (silicon oil 20 ct)	26.6
Jojoba oil Gold	26.2
Myritol ® 312	25.3
Isopropyl palmitate	25.2
Octyldodecanol	24.8
Dioctyl adipate (ARLAMOL ® DOA)	24.5
Isopropyl myristate	24.2
Octyl palmitate (2-ethylhexyl palmitate)	23.1
Hexamethyldisiloxane	22.7
Macadamia nut oil	22.1
Rapeseed oil	21.9
Isopropyl stearate	21.9
Isopropyl stearate	21.9
Caprylic/capric triglycerides	21.3
Isopropyl isostearate	21.2
Jojoba oil	20.8
Cyclomethicone (ARLAMOL ® D4)	20.6
Groundnut oil	20.5
Almond oil	20.3
Sunflower oil	19.3
Decyl oleate	18.7
Avocado oil	18.3
Olive oil	16.9
Dibutyl adipate	14.3
Castor oil	13.7
Calendula oil	11.1
Water	10.2

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/y2004/0258654.html

I don’t know how accurate is this list (c/c triglycerides is more polar than sunflower oil, based on my experience), but I would rely on Tony Olenick’s point 
https://www.cosmeticsandtoiletries.com/research/chemistry/17390254.html

“Typical polar oils are fatty alcohols, esters and triglyce­rides”. Vegetable oils are mostly triglycerides, which means they should be polar. 

[ngarayeva001]

@africanbug, I don’t know what limitations you have when it comes to materials but it’s relatively easy to find decent w/o emulsifiers that can be classified as natural. Can you change emulsifier or you must use olivem? You can try a combo of polyglyceryl-2 DPHS and isolan GPS and squalane plus coco caprylate as your oils. Need to check my formulas but I remember this combination works pretty well. It can even be processed cold with zinc stearate as a stabiliser.

[ngarayeva001]

I agree polarity is important when you formulate w/o. You were using vegetable oils as I remember and they all are pretty polar. I couldn’t find a comprehensive list of polarities either, however as a general rule most vegetable oils are polar, silicone and hydrocarbons are non-polar. Esters can be all types. If you try to keep formula ‘natural’, squalane is plant derived hydrocarbon. I usually use isododecane, isopropyl myristate (both non-polar) silicones and add medium polarity esters (coco caprylate, octyl palmitate, cetearyl isonononoate etc) in w/o. You might want to try coco caprylate and squalane.

[ngarayeva001]

You need to add wax with a higher melting point to prevent that from happening. Cera Bellina is pretty soft in general and it’s melting point is around 65 if I am not mistaken. Have a look at candelilla or even beeswax. 

[ngarayeva001]

Polyhydroxy acids (PHA) are trendy now. They said to be more gentle than AHAs (read less effective too). Gluconolactone is actually used in Lotion P50, I however think that it’s the lactic acid that does the main job there.

[ngarayeva001]

Most of sunscreens (especially physical) are w/o. It helps with dispersion of particles  and also w/o are water resistant which is a very useful quality for a sunscreen. Yours includes both physical and chemical sunscreens so I guess you can keep it as w/o but add something that would create a film on the skin and stops the product from shifting. People tend to rub their face a lot.

[ngarayeva001]

Do you mean Polysorbate 20 a solubiliser? I have never seen PEG-20 a humectant on DIY market.

[ngarayeva001]

Hey guys. Well you can actually create a gel that is w/o or better w/si without acrylates (like Sepinov, Aristoflex). But it definitely must have more than 5% of oil (it will still feel light). The best emulsifier for this would be Abil EM 90. 

This product by Laneige is a good example of a light gel

Water, Cyclopentasiloxane,Cyclohexasiloxane, Alcohol,Dimethicone/​Vinyl Dimethicone Crosspolymer, Glycerin, Trehalose,Cetyl PEG/​PPG-10/​1 Dimethicone,Dimethicone, Sodium Chloride,Phenoxyethanol, Polysilicone-11,Biosaccharide Gum-1, Disteardimonium Hectorite, Fragrance, Glyceryl Caprylate, Sea Water,Ethylhexylglycerin, Disodium EDTA,Vinyl Dimethicone/​Methicone Silsesquioxane Crosspolymer, Butylene Glycol, Magnesium Aspartate, Zinc Gluconate, Calcium Gluconate,Copper Gluconate

[ngarayeva001]

What kind of TiO2? Is it micronized? Also, it’s not generally a good idea to make sunscreen as O/W. You should at least add a film former.

[ngarayeva001]

You can  use search function of this forum to figure it out. I clearly  remember mentioning how to thicken sarcosinate.

[ngarayeva001]

@Pharma, thank you so much! It means my template works!