[mikethair]

Here’s a pic of the dish wash I produced and exported globally.

[mikethair]

I’m doing the best I can within my limited capacity as a scientist. Maybe I should give it up, I’m obviously not performing to your high expectations.

[mikethair]

According to the dictionary, the term “ecofriendly” means “not harmful to the environment, or trying to help the environment.” I referred to the Cambridge Dictionary. So not, as you have said, “subjective nontechnical ad-speak.”

And again, I have never had issues with soap scum.

[mikethair]

Yes indeed, liquid hand dish wash.

When you say “eco-friendly is meaningless,” I disagree. Using only plant oils and not the usual synthetics (or their greenwashed synthetics) goes some way to be eco-friendly.

And I have difficulty with your reference to “plant based SLS Na lauryl sulfate, ” and much prefer to use saponified plant oils. A lot more eco-friendly once they go back into our environment.

To-date, after many years of producing ” true soap,” have never had complaints of “soap scum.”

• This reply was modified 1 month, 2 weeks ago by  mikethair.

[mikethair]

My approach was to saponify plant oils. It ticks all the boxes. And produced a very profitable dish wash liquid.

[mikethair]

From where I’m sitting, that’s a very complex formulation for an eye cream. I would be looking at a much simpler oil formulation in a dropper bottle, and without all the synthetics.

[mikethair]

Why is viscosity such an issue for you? I do similar, and my approach is to use the oil as is and apply it directly to the skin. Of course, I do a thorough allergens analysis of the oils.

[mikethair]

If you are targeting the luxury market, your products need to not just hold a promise, they must manifest a myth, and make the intangible brand believably tangible. And I would suggest you redefine the shower oil category and set new high standards. This elevates your followers to a higher level of existence and price.

[mikethair]

No surprises here, the formulation is a cocktail of synthetics.

I produced a very successful face wash by saponifying extra-virgin olive oil. I exported globally, it was a great seller and revenue producer.

[mikethair]

One thing I did that was VERY popular was saponify discarded palm oil to make a laundry detergent. It ticked quite a few boxes in re-purposing something that was usually disposed of. I had a good global market for this laundry / dish wash/household general cleaner.

Once I got the method and formulation sorted, I outsourced the production to a local group of intellectually disabled. So ticked a few more boxes. And the market grew as a result.

[mikethair]

And another thought. If you don’t ask, you won’t get. So as a customer, it is incumbent on you to ask the CM these types of questions.

[mikethair]

It’s an issue of transparency. The CM has a responsibility to be 100% transparent about the ingredients. In my 20-year experience in CM, this was always my approach.

[mikethair]

It’s all about the fragrance formulation. I have never used synthetic fragrances, and much prefer essential oils. And the secret is tied up in the quality of essential oil (most these days are adulterated and low quality) and the formulation, especially the ratio of the base, middle and top notes.

Fragrance formulation is a specialised task that takes years of practice. With my experience as
the co-founder of a skincare manufacturing factory in Viet Nam and Malaysia
since 2006 where I was responsible for all creating formulations, I’m still learning every day.

[mikethair]

Whaoa……. didn’t realise we had so many medical professionals here.

In my opinion, if you are producing skincare products to treat acne, then you are in for a hiding from the likes of MoCRA.

[mikethair]

For mixing large batches, here is a photo of what I used since 2006. It was hand held.

[mikethair]

Yes, but there is a niche in the marketplace that does not want to use these synthetic surfactant products. It’s that simple. Of course, this niche is of no interest to the large conglomerates that dominate this market.

Again, we never had any issues with soap scum. This is due to the formulation I produced.

[mikethair]

Yes, I agree; effectiveness is difficult to determine. In our case, we simply relied on the feedback from our consumers and return sales. The consensus was that the product worked without any harmful effects.

[mikethair]

Thanks for your kind words and details of your own endeavours.

Soapmaking is an interest of mine and for years in Malaysia and Viet Nam the focus of our business. It provided much-needed employment in the local community. And an opportunity to export globally.

Yes, it is a niche industry and massive profits and turnover were never our aim. But financially, we did well.

For a large company, I would not recommend traditional soap making.

[mikethair]

Indeed, soap making is an art, and in doing so it provides an opportunity to make your mark in the marketplace.

And at the same time, a chance to share your philosophy and identity, and this is what people are buying into. In taking this stance, you are not bossed around by the consumer or market and become more driven by your own convictions. In my case, it was old-fashioned values from simpler times and exotic fragrances that you away to a time and place where life moves more leisurely.

And a very good reason why andy982183 should pursue soap as the basis for his product.

• This reply was modified 1 month, 1 week ago by  mikethair.

[mikethair]

I’m an individual, so I post what I want, and I don’t need your permission before posting.

[mikethair]

A side story to all of this. As a scientist, I wanted to push things a bit further, and as I was living in Malaysia at the time where I realised there was a lot of used Palm Oil being discarded down drains.

So I teamed up with a group of intellectually and physically disabled to collect this used palm oil, and I spent months teaching them how to saponify this collected Palm Oil to produce a general household cleaner, package and sell to produce themselves some income.

And this project still runs today providing them with a sustainable income.

So I will leave all your negativity with you, and your expertise in digging up references from the web, while I continue with my work as a scientist and to turn my knowledge into something that can benefit those who are disadvantaged.

[mikethair]

Yes indeed, the science is clear. I produced these products for 17 years, after spending one year perfecting the formulation, including extensive consumer evaluations globally. Yep, DHL loved me!!!

Saponification is complex, and the formulation has many variables, including the oils used, saponification values used, and super-fat calculations.

And, scum was not an issue with what I finally produced.

Question? Have you yourself ever produced these products, or are you simply trotting out well-known fallacies perpetuated by the producers of synthetic cleansers?

[mikethair]

I’m available and have developed and produced similar products.

From nothing, in 2006, I co-founded two skincare manufacturing factories, which ran until 2023. This gives me 17 years experience of hands-on experience in formulating and making skincare plus various dish washes. My products were exported globally.

It’s best to contact me directly via email: mikethair@gmail.com

[mikethair]

Thanks ozgirl, good to know.

[mikethair]

With your comment “Without sulfates it will be much more difficult to get good foaming (not
impossible just more difficult),” I have found that by using the right combination of saponified plant oils, good foaming is not an issue. For example, coconut oil is a good one to add to a combination of oils to increase foaming.

The global brand Dr Bronners, who also saponify plant oils, do not have foaming issues. And of course you can avoid all the health issues of using synthetic surfactants.