ketchito
Forum Replies Created
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@Bax65 Electrolyte content is a critical parameter when using Styrene acryate copolymer opacifiers, especially in a SLES-CAPB-NaCl system. You can check this info from Dow: https://chemical-centre.com/f/pcopac.pdf.
@Tyss There are different types of styrene acrylate copolymer opacifiers, ones more sensitive to others to electrolytes, but 1.7% NaCl is indeed high for your system. I’d advise you to switch from NaCl to Crothix Liquid, just to check if the level of NaCl is indeed messing with your formula.
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@Tyss Styrene acrylate copolymer is sensitive to electrolytes, so that might be the problem. You could try to either increase the amount of SLES (this would increase viscosity a bit and help dissolve some structures that might give you the hazy appearance), or increase either the Betaine or CDEA…all of this, along with a reduction of Sodium chloride. You could even add a rheology modifier (Crothix is a nice choice).
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@Rafique If the issue doesn’t show up when you put the product away from UV light and If there’s no pH drift causing the color fade, then add a small amount of a UV absrober (such as Benzophenone-4…0.05% might work).
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@leftone Since Cocoamphoacetate is a basic material, and at enough low pH both Benzoate and Salicylate are present in their acid forms, you might be experiencing and acid-base reaction, which results in an insoluble salt that lately sediments. You can either use an anionic surfactant instead, or switch (as you did) to a more compatible amphoteric.
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@chemistry8303 Cetyl alcohol is a bit too high. Also, you can add some Carbopol to help stabilize/thicken your system.
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@chemistry8303 Cetyl alcohol forms a lamellar gel with surfactants, helping thickening a bit while cooling. PEG-150 distearate on the other hand due to its high ethoxylation, interacts with the polar head of surfactants in micelles as a non ionic (as you might have seen, non ionic ethoxylated surfactants don’t give much viscosity when combined with anionics), that’s why Glycol distearate is preferred for creamy shampoos.
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@filiz Providing that you don’t have many more thins in your formula, you could replace your c12-13 alkyl lactate with either Versathix or Crothix Liquid (both by Croda). They help increase viscosity on very hard to thicken systems, using low amounts. As long as you don’t have anything to suspend like mica or silicones, you’d be fine.
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@Richa Carbopols can (and usually are) used with anionic surfactants, like SLES. Once neutralized, Carbopols have a negative charge, similarly to SLES. Polyquats can be used with this system as well, providing that you add CAPB before the Polyquat.
By the way, you have way too many extracts, and in very high amounts, considering that in a rinse-off product they won’t do much, and will challenge your preservative system (actually, potassium sorbate alone not only is not advisable as a broad spectrum preservative, but it’ll be easily overwhelmed by your high level of botanicals).
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@filiz Two things come to my mind:
1) make a premix of Coco glucoside with the Essence, mix it till it gets clear, and then add it to the batch,
2) try replacing Sodium chloride by Cocamide DEA (or similar, like MIPA or MEA), or by Crothix Liquid (or Versathix)
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@Hamaadali008 Usually shampoos have a mixture of more than 2 surfactats of different types. The issue with anionic surfactants (especially the ones with high charge density like SLS) is that part of them exist as micelles (above a limit called CMC, or when combined with Betaines which actually reduce the CMC at which micelles form) and as free molecules (called unimers). The more unimers, the more the chance thay they interact with skin proteins and cause irritation. You want more micelles, and that’s whay you mix your anionics with amphoteric surfactants (like Betaines) or cationic polymers (like polyquaterniums). Maybe you can modify your ration SLS/Betaine, or even add a third surfactant like Cocoamphodiacetate or Lauramine oxide, or even replace part of your SLS for more ethoxylated version (like SLES), or a milder anionic (like Taurate, Sulfosuccinate, Glycinate, etc.).
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@sean9980 You can make a solution dissolving your 90% NaOH in enough water to get the 18% solution of NaOH.
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@Zink I remember than a mixture of Magnesium Aluminum Silicate and Xanthan gum have also synergy even in low pH systems…never tried it though.
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@helenhelen You probably experienced an indirect effect of carbomers (which deposit on skin creating a film that holds water molecules), and some other polymers added (like PEG-12 dimethicone). I don’t think small molecules like Glycerin would give a perceivable effect, considering they penetrate the skin very fast and that the level used in these type of products is very low. Actually, I’d be cautious about using these type of humectants in hand sanitizers, since the are proved to reduce the potency of alcohol. Even the FDA issued a recommendation about it and some other actives usually found in hand sanitizers (like Aloe Vera).
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@ajw000 For instance, even though you added 10.61% of Coco Glucoside, that material comes commercially as a 50% solution, so you’d need to calculate the real level of Coco Glucoside you are putting to the formula, which is 10.61*0.5 = 5.305%. This should be done for all surfactants (check the their technical sheets), and the sum will be your real surfactant content in your formula.
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@filiz Lamesoft TM Benz is an opacifier (not pearlizer) that can replace styrene based opacifiers very well. You can give it a try.
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@ssdc I’d advise you to check the data sheet of your ingredients for compatibilty, and to check if there’s some water present in any of them.
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@ajw000 If I did my calculations correclty, your surfactant active matter content (expressed as 100% concentration of each surfactant) is around 30%, which is way too high. For a shampoo, it’s usually between 12-14% (very generaly speaking).
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@filiz You could try with a glycol distearate based opacifier instead. Also, I would make one sample without the opacifier, to see is viscosity is Ok without the opacifier (or not, in which case we’re blaming the wrong guy). Then, I’d put half of the sample in the fridge and half in the oven.
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@filiz Styrene / acrylates copolymer is a very sensitive opacifier, and as I mentioned, it doesn’t like salt much, which by the formula you posted, might be in fairly high amounts to get the proper viscosity. Also, if your pH is low (lower than 5.5), Betaine starts behaving like a cationic, making the system mor unstable.
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@ulalabebe That ingredient is a cationic surfactant, which actas as conditioning agent and as mild emulsifier. If your intention is to directly replace it, it can be done by similar dialkyl cationic (like Dicetyldimonium chloride), or a mono alkyl cationic (like Behentrimonium chloride or methosulfate, Cetrimonium chloride, or similar).
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@Zink You could use Sepimax Zen, although it ain’t cheap either. One option is to mix Sepimax Zen with either Tara or Guar gum (they show synergy), so you’d need to use lees of your Sepimax. Not sure about the clarity of those gums at low pH, but it’d be worth trying.
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@ssdc It’d be better to know what else is in your formula. Keep in mind that not oil soluble ingredients are compatible between them.
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@ngarayeva001 I’m with you 100%. Hopefuly, missleading claims in cosmetics would be more strictly regulated, especially the many dubious “studies” that suppliers have to advertise benefits of their magical ingredients.
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@Shams You can use a cationic like BTM-50 or a non ionic like Ceteareth-20 (only the latter can impair some preservatives’ availability).