jemolian
Forum Replies Created
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@ozgirl supposedly a pinch is about 1/16 teaspoon, so it’s about 0.35g. I’d assume for EDTA, it’s workable up to a 1kg batch for a pinch?
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To be honest, i think using a whisk is still fine because we can be slightly short of budget or basic equipment at home. Using a milk frother is worse. :#
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Speaking about cooking, this kills me
Comments from the natural FB groups always does, so…
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I vaguely remember you talked about Sepimat quite some time ago with Pattsi & ngarayeva001. It didn’t work out?
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Have you tried xanthan gum? lol. Would a stringy look be part of your marketing? Because it’s not something that is particularly marketed. Normally this kind of stringy texture is used for marketing snail mucin or some premium polymers humectants like Polyglutamic Acid creams.
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@dell
Mainly because they would be washed off, so using a higher percentage would be a waste, more so with the Sodium PCA. They would still work best in a leave on product.You can reduce the Coco Glucoside as singhc10 suggested as well, besides from taking out the oils and Polysorbate. Personally i find that the Sodium Lauroyl Sarcosinate with Cocamidopropyl Betaine combination should work fine by themselves. You can adjust the ration accordingly based on your test. You can add them to a foaming bottle to test a small batch without needing to make a thickened batch everytime.
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You can try cutting out them out and test out different percentage of your basic surfactant mixture and see how it goes. It’s best to leave the oils in a leave on product if you really want to moisturize. You can also try reducing the glycerin and cutting out the sodium PCA as well.
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Perhaps if you took out the oils and thus the polysorbate, the result might be better with the lower amount of surfactants in general.
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5% Urea for the body & 3% Hydroxyethyl Urea (solids)
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If based on basic information on paper:
Besides from Urea normally being a solid and Hydroxyethyl Urea in liquid form, both can have their challenges since they can cause a drift in pH. This would be stated in the Hydrovance (Hydroxyethyl Urea) product brochure or TDS. That would probably be the main challenge if at all.If based on experience and observation:
Urea exfoliates me. For Hydroxyethyl Urea, based on the toner i made for my aunt, she hasn’t feedback anything regarding the issue for exfoliation. I haven’t tried it on myself at the moment. -
I think with the 202, it’s relatively light and non bodying, so in case you need to add anymore thickness to it via another fatty alcohol or other waxes i think it should work out. More so with the mattifying finish that it has, unless your target customers prefer a more glossy look when applied.
Normally i’d make my body / hand cream with just 202, which is quite light weight. In terms of the hands wise, i’d say it’s what i’d prefer. My colleague prefer something thicker, so i used the 68.
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Perhaps only Montanov 68, unless you can get some of the 82 to test out if it’s reaching your expectations.
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@abierose
if you can’t find Emulium Delta, perhaps you can try Lipomulse Luxe. You can compared the sensory profile, which they have done so on the product brochure with Emulium Delta. It’s available on Trulux.https://azeliscanada.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/Lipomulse-Luxe-Brochure-1.pdf
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@Pharma
Normally i’d purchase small samples from the repackers from China from Taobao and 1688. Not sure if you’d be able to purchase from there via a forwarder. For Diisostearyl Malate, the chinese term would be 二异硬脂醇苹果酸酯.On Taobao, they have the small sample size for the Haimalate DIS (80g) that i purchased, Cosmol 222 (500g), and エステロール DISM (from National Mimatsu, 1kg). On 1688, they have 1kg or litre amounts.
I’d use Chemical Book to look for the chinese terms, so if there’s anything else you need look for you can try the database. They list some of the chinese suppliers as well. https://www.chemicalbook.com/ProductIndex.aspxI’m also trying to find SALACOS WO-6 (Dipentaerythrityl Tri-Polyhydroxystearate) but can’t really find a sample amount. If you do have any leads, hope you’d let me know. ::smile:
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The cost was part of my consideration so that’s why i bought the Tridecyl Trimellitate for testing. 🙂 Normally i’d compare the cost from the china repackers, the cost is about 4 times of the Tridecyl Trimellitate per litre.
Normally i’d do some searches on the products that contains certain ingredients via some product database, like here for Diisostearyl Malate.
https://incidecoder.com/ingredients/diisostearyl-malate -
For Diisostearyl Malate, it was the first out of the three that i had tried. I was trying to find a heavier emollient for a longer lasting moisturization, so when comparing a few combinations and based on observation, the combination with the Diisostearyl Malate works best. My skin was actually quite moisturized throughout the whole day.
- Isononyl Isononanoate + Cromollient DP3A (Di-PPG-3 Myristyl Ether Adipate)
- Capric / Caprylic Triglyceride + Squalane (Olive)
- Isononyl Isononanoate + Haimalate DIS (Diisostearyl Malate)
For Cromollient DP3A, it was moisturized for the short term but when i woke up, my skin was slightly dry.
So when comparing the following, they seem to work similarly.
- Isononyl Isononanoate + Haimalate DIS (Diisostearyl Malate)
- Parleam (Hydrogenated Polyisobutene) + Liponate TDTM (Tridecyl Trimellitate)
When doing a patch test of 5% of each (Tridecyl Trimellitate, Diisostearyl Malate, Pentaerythrityl Tetraisostearate) in a gel based with Aristoflex AVC, in the short term the moisturization feels very similar. Maybe it’s just me, i somehow feel that the Diisostearyl Malate is very very slightly more moisturizing?
Last night, I made a batch with just Tridecyl Trimellitate without the Parleam and my moisturizer still works. Just that it’s not as fast spreading. I think i’ll make a batch again with just Diisostearyl Malate alone and see how well it will compare. But i think the result would likely be similar.
I’m interested to try and see how Isopropyl Isostearate compares.
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It depends on what you mean by “powerful”. I’m personally not a fan of plant oils since they have a chance of breaking me out.
For the choice of emollient, it depends on the emolliency, glossiness, fatty acid profile, stability in a formula, etc. There are a lot of choices to that.
I’m currently testing with the esters that are castor oil alternatives such as Tridecyl Trimellitate, Diisostearyl Malate, Pentaerythrityl Tetraisostearate. They provide more heavier duty emolliency, which will be good in combination with other light esters or emollients.
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Just my personal opinion, i’d recommend looking at consolidated percentages of humectants and individual humectants that are in the formulation.
The Natrasmooth contains Tremella, Betaine & Glycerin. If you are using liquid extracts, then the Licorice and Green Tea would likely have Glycerin in them as well, so depending on how much Glycerin you need, you might not need to add additional Glycerin as an individual ingredient since it would be tacky.
Depending on how well the Tremella & Hyaluronic Acid thickens, you might not need to add 1% Tara Gum as well, a lower percentage can be added to thicken slightly more if that is what you need.
You will need to make sure that the Optiphen is fully solubilized if that is your concern.
Also it depends on how well the Urea performs on your skin. It can hydrate but it can also add some tackiness and act as an exfoliator. Allantoin can also act as a mild exfoliator.
The percentage of Propylene Glycol is relatively high, you can consider lowering that based on how the skin feel goes.
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You would be able to. Ultimately it depends on your combination and percentage of Active Surfactant Matter based on your preference on foam or performance.
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@ifamuj my CCT has a smell that i don’t really like that much by itself, but other than that, i prefer to use at max at about 10%.
At 20%, you need to test if you like the skin feel or not, so i don’t think it’s something that i can comment too much on because it’s a personal preference or formulation requirement to the lipid selection.
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I saw you mention the Hydrogenated Polyisobutene so i went ahead to order some from china, with the trade name PARLEAM, which is roughly similar to Squalane in terms of profile. Wanted to try the 1200 version from Making cosmetics but it’s out of stock
Still working on increasing the emollency of my moisturizer with the heavier esters, though Isononyl Isononoate works relatively well in skin softening, and moisturization in the short term (perhaps up to 4 to 6 hours in more drying conditions).
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@Graillotion i bought mine from china as per usual, but then in terms of skin feel wise, Isononyl Isononoate’s profile is very fast spreading, silky and relatively fast absorbing even up to 20%.
You can see some of the info on performance here ->
https://www.dropbox.com/s/mpv0hbaaq91etct/DOC%20FICHE%20DUB%20ININ.pdf?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/nc5xfxi2dwpx22e/Lanol%2099.pdf?dl=0I can’t compare too much since i normally use esters that are not sold in the US, such as Cetyl Ethylhexanoate or Triethylhexanoin, but they are all relatively very light esters, so in terms of performance wise, they are quite close. If the ones you have are light esters or lighter than Capric / Caprylic Triglyceride, i think they would be quite similar.
I’ve been testing with some of the thicker, more emollient esters like Di-PPG-3 Myristyl Ether Adipate, Pentaerythrityl Tetraisostearate, Diisostearyl Malate.
Just bought some Hydrogenated Polyisobutene, so hope to test it when it arrives.
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@ifamuj normally for my formulations i use esters such as Isononyl Isononanoate. I rarely use plant oils, butters, waxes, and mineral oils.
The type of lipids largely depends on your requirements such as cost, skin feel, brand philosophy, product and marketing requirements.
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Depending on what you are trying to formulate and what kind of reference product you are using for reference, the barebones or essential ingredients can vary, for example, a standard cream formulation would minimally contain:
- Water
- Emulsifier
- Lipid
- Humectant (Some medical active creams may contain propylene glycol instead of glycerin)
- Preservative
The rest of the ingredients, you can use them for added extras. Though to answer your questions in general, I’d recommend to patch test them separately to see if they actually do anything for your skin before deciding to add them to your formulation. For example, normally if i’m trying out if an ingredient works or not, i’d be applying my usual moisturizer, plus that ingredient formulated separately in a different form, such as a gel. This way i can see if they do anything for my skin at specific percentages over a few applications.
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we sell to stores and our customers purchase from stores.They communicate with shopkeeper and we are not in direct communication with consumer.
We will add the phone number on label the next time we were printing label’s so consumer would be able to directly communicate with us if necessary.
If you sell to stores, it would be good to communicate to the retailers well. Providing them with product knowledge, sufficient marketing materials, etc, would be useful in selling the products.
As someone that use to work in a small online skin care retail store as a marketer, that’s what i would recommend and expect to see from brand companies where support would always be greatly appreciated.
As a brand owner, online presence where you can do social media marketing and monitoring, pre-sales and post-sales would also be important. That would be one good way to understanding your demographic for various reasons.
