David
Forum Replies Created
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Why not PVP?
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Up to you to decide what a “deep conditioner” is. Use the 1/2 or dubble method to test, 3% is a good starting point.
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For baby amphoteric surfactants are usually recommened.
You could probably also use a “normal” shampoo and dilute it with water.
pH doesn’t really matter as long as it is between 5-8 -
1. what Bob said.
2. Depends how you define a “cream” , most people define it as an emulsion, and an emusion without emulsifier i inherently unstable. -
I made an oilbased one once using Arlatone TV (PEG-40 Sorbitan Peroleate) - it worked quite ok.
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Regarding the L-DOPA here is another patent from 1990, which mentions an even older patent describing hair coloring with DOPA ( European Pat. No. 161073A of 1984) , didn’t find it though. Finding a PPD alternative is a difficult task and nobody has really succeded yet. In my opinion the chance of finding an alternative is also limited due to the fact that the alternative molecule has to be small enough to penetrate the hair cuticle. Although the number of compounds a chemist (or nature) can synthesize are infinite, the number of molecules with a MW <200 are not so many in comparison.
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@kinome - in the case of PPD allergy I would recommend using direct dyes (temporary) instead. You can reach better results if bleach the hair first.
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Here’s another opinion from a chemists’ view of (permanent) hair dyes:
My advice to a hair stylist is unless your customer is sensitized to PPD or its derivatives there is no reason at all to look for natural alternatives for hair dye.
1. They don’t work as well.
2. They can be even more sensitizing than synthetic dyes. -
Personally I like adding some PEG-45M or PEG-90M, gives a nice pseudo-moisturizing feel to rinse-off products.
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…and still it is hard to be sure. Almost all shaving gels have glycerine or sorbitol in them. When I was (re)formulating a shaving gel I kept glycerine in there mostly for the moisturizing claim but when testing (on myself) I didn’t notice any difference. A quat made a difference though. However to “feel” moisturized and to “be” moisturized are usually two different things.
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@johnb @Bill_Toge ;
Sorry, my fault - this is about ozonides. -
found this by googleing
not a reliable source but to me it sounds they haven’t changed the formula - only corrected the INCI
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@Bill_Toge -good point - a quat would help both the emulsifying and the curl enhancing. A quat you should be able to “feel” when testing. However it is too far down the list -or wait - the list is may be wrong -
Wrong LOI actually is worse than no LOI when duplicating.. -
PPD (p-phenylenediamine) and some of its derivaties are still the only options for black hair color that can resist shampooing. But don’t try to mix it @ home!
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@johnb thanks for sharing 🙂
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With wrong INCI names it is a bit of challenge to duplicate. However, if you start with the three first ingredients(assuming they are correct) and find an appropriate emulsifier you may be on the right way.
@Belassi they could also mean Sorbitan Oleate, Sorbitan Monostearate ,Sorbitan Stearate..which all have a low HLB -
In organic chemistry recrystallising is an effective purification step. Of course it is possible to analyse a liquid but getting pure crystals with a defined melting point is a first “proof” of that your synthesis has succeeded
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It is just a coincidence that you found this “benz”-pattern. “Benz” in a chemical name has no correlation to allergy.
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I did a 2-phase hair conditioner once. While the formulating is quite fun - you can e.g. control the phase separation by adding different amounts of sodium chloride - a bit like a salt curve. Filling is timeconsuming and messy and we also filled the phases separately after trying to fill with constant mixing.
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@Belassi Haven’t calculated he amount needed for neutralizing a soap. However, e.g. the CIR Panel concluded that Sodium Borate and Boric Acid, in concentrations =< 5%, are safe in cosmetic products. http://online.personalcarecouncil.org/ctfa-static/online/lists/cir-pdfs/pr215.pdf
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@Bobzchemist - could it be a way of making preservative free cosmetics?Increase the pH then use acid granules or encapsulated acid which dissolves when rubbing on the skin to get a skin friendly pH.
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No, you don’t “need” to. It has an influence on your end product though since “X”-stearate and stearic acid are two different chemical compunds. Also what you neutralize it with has an impact. To my knowledge partially neutralised is most common in a cream. Best is to make a couple of experiments…
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@BartJ good analysis Bart, it appears to me that the EU chemists haven’t thought this over very much. Here is another entry in cosing saying it is reprotoxic at>4.5% (not 5.5%). It is all a mess indeed. As a SA and a chemist I definitely still not believe a content of 0.5% sodium borate in a hand cream is a danger to human health but to prove it in court ..well..that’s a different story.