[Charlene]

Maybe you like this to read:

https://www.prestigeonline.com/th/beauty-wellness/wellness/why-do-some-skin-care-products-sting-after-applying/?itm_source=parsely-api

Look at the acid that is in the cleanser

[Charlene]

Sincityfire said:

Milady’s Skin Care and Cosmetic Ingredients Dictionary by M. Varinia Michalun and Natalia Michalun. 

It’s used in esthetician/beauty therapist courses. It is a good book for beginners looking for a foundation in how and why products work on the skin, explains jargon and terminology, has a substantial dictionary of ingredients and what they do. 

Thank you for the recommendation

[Charlene]

Thank you both I see if I can get them here 

[Charlene]

If somebody  has recommendations please let me know

[Charlene]

@jemolian, @Graillotion, @Pattsi, @Perry

I want to thank you all very much for the response and give me your personal insight and approach to developing a product.

For now, I will keep it simple and with two CPSR forms in my pocket this week I am very happy and proud and very grateful for all the nice people here that take the effort to respond to my questions.

I hope to give a little bit more back in the near future when my knowledge gets a little bit better and bigger.

[Charlene]

Pharma said:

I recently tried something out and thought I’d incorporate 4 new ingredients. I had to ‘balance them out’ (using HLD estimations) with some more ingredients, added oils and butters to give a nice viscosity/spreading cascade, topped that with a mimicry of NMF (polyols, amino acids, HA, etc.), rounded it off with some actives I like, and had to preserve all with the ‘hurdle approach’ (bunch of stuff)… ended up with a LOI with 40+ positions. Well, easy, quickly measured whatcha worry, right? Yea, it looked fine for an hour and then phase inversed and now looks like slimy piss and has a funny fishy odour. Good job, I’m so proud of myself! I now can pretty much draw straws which of the different things caused the issue (I have a suspicion but to test that, I’d have to weigh anoter 40 times). :smiley:

By weighing/wasting less ingredients I could have made 4 different products which would not just have been more stable but would also have given me a real impression on how those 4 new ingredients actually feel like…

KISS is the way to go (I hate it and it somehow hurts… and hence I ignore it repeatedly just to proof to myself time and time again that life would be easy if you made it easy).

???? Although I feel sorry for you that your product didn’t turn out as how it suppose to be I’m glad to read the solution. 
Thank you for sharing this it needs guts to admit you made a mistake

I understand if you have so much experience and are a pharmacist or a professional well trained formulater your knowledge base is so big that you want to try everything right?

Lessons in live taught me that you sometimes have to step back a little and ask yourself ” hold on a moment what is my goal?” How do I get there as good and easy as possible.

It’s just like food  you can eat in a 5 star restaurant where you have a fancy meal with all kind of fancy dressings and sides but if you compare it with a 4 ingredient home made stew with mashed potatoes smelling like the old good days  I know what I will choose

[Charlene]

@MarkBroussard

That is easy to remember 
 I am happy to read that I’m on the right path.
Thank you very much

[Charlene]

SugarHouse said:

@Stanley I think your post is a bit mean. Not everyone has the opportunity to undertake a chemistry degree at university. I am self-taught. I had no intention ever of becoming a formulator. However, I was messed about so much by formulators here in Australia. I lost thousands of dollars, not to mention valuable time. In the end, I had no choice but to make the products myself.

I couldn’t have done what I’ve done without the help and advice from the kind people on this forum. Now I try to post where I can to help others. 

Please don’t exclude us.

I totally agree with this statement !
With the start of covid ,losing a job to old for other jobs and having a entrepreneurs state of mind and mentality that you are never to old to taught yourself something I started my journey.
I always had interest in cosmetics and skincare but as so many of us I wasn’t in the position to make a choice!
Now when I’m 50 I want to make myself a better person than I was and follow my dream.
Yes I still have a lot to learn and study and this forum is a great help!!! I think if people read better the forum rules where it clearly says try to find the answer first yourself on internet.
Let keeps this forum nice and polite there is enough “social” media where people don’t like eachother and are not be able to help.
No one say that you have to read or to answer any question that is placed here 

[Charlene]

Thank you 

[Charlene]

Pattsi said:

shea butter - cold process with stick blender?

No I used a mixer I don’t work with a stick blender

[Charlene]

That’s a very good point I didn’t think about that thank you

[Charlene]

Pattsi said:

I’m getting a Lush-vibe.

I hope this is a good thing 

Thank you for your comment

[Charlene]

clay?

[Charlene]

Graillotion said:

As said above….stay off the mommy blogger sites…as that will all have to be unlearned if you hope to progress in this area.
Secondly…Aloe does not make a butter…that is some man made product….more than likely a lot of soybean margarine….and WHO KNOWS WHAT ELSE, as it is a completely fabricated item.
As you did not mention water…your concoction is not an emulsion.
(Delete from your favorites…the site that said glycerin was oil soluble…thank me later.)

I thank you…I had to laugh but this time I didn’t had the info from a “mommy blogger site”.
I agree with you and I stay away from websites that talk about cosmetics in the way of 1 teaspoon of this and 2 tablespoons of that and at last a few drops of the miracle.
I understand that making cosmetics goes a little bit further than the “great Britisch Bake off”
I also understand that aloe vera doesnt make a butter My fault that I didnt tell you that it is a blend with coconut oil and soya oil.

Anyway thanks for the respond and give a smile on my face I love to read everything to improve

[Charlene]

MarkBroussard said:

@Charlene:

I would suggest that perhaps you change your source of reading materials since it appears you are getting some incorrect information.

Glycerin is not an emulsifier.

Glycerin is water-soluble.

Thank you, as I mention it this product confuses me because I use butter and carrier oils with glycerin and it dissolves beautifully.
Could this be because I do cold produce?

[Charlene]

Abdullah said:

Cleanser removes everything from surface of your skin and makes it clean.
Aloe Vera butter and and glycerin will not work as cleanser.

Emulsifier makes oil and water combin.
Glycerin will not make oil and water combin. 

These are your imaginations????

Vegetable glycerin can help gently cleanse while not stripping the skin (or hair) of moisture. It makes a great addition to body cleansers of all types. 

My imagination goes far and sometimes fools me but my eyes don’t lie the product is nice, light, and looks stable even if I put it with warm hands on the skin

[Charlene]

I counted your formula and you end up at 95 percent maybe you forgot something?. I’ve hardly experience with the products you are using the only I know is that vitamins E can max be 0.4 percent.

[Charlene]

I love to work with shea and it depends on your formula if it feels greasy or not.

maybe this is a nice read for you

https://coxistencesoaps.com/blogs/news/compare-shea-cocoa-mango-kokum-butter-natural-skincare-beauty

[Charlene]

Maybe this helps you a little further

https://www.ehso.com/msdscreate.php

[Charlene]

PhilGeis said:

Be careful with “Hurdle” technology - it’s not for the inexperienced.  It establishes inhibition rather than kill - so may not give a PET “pass”.  Compromise of any factor - even temporarily in making - can bring the house down.

In any case, good luck CHarley!

Thank you very much 
I will keep the house complete

[Charlene]

@Graillotion,
@Abdullah,
@PhilGeis,
@Microformulation,

All thank you for your responses I notice that I have to read a lot more.
I appreciate all the input 

[Charlene]

MarkBroussard said:

Ok, so you have an issue with Yeast & Mold. 

Why is your final pH 7.2? … is there an issue with reducing your pH to below 6.0 (preferrably pH 4.?

There is no single preservative that is effective solo in a cosmetic formulation that provides broad spectrum activity at any pH level … that is marketing hype.

Study up on using Hurdle Technology in your approach to preservation.  As I mentioned, the problem is that your product is not properly preserved.

Thank you I will Study about the Hurdle Technology  

I think I can reduce the PH I have to read in that also, to be honest, I wanted as close as possible to PH Balanced between pH 4 and pH 7 with my ingredients I ended up at 7.2 and it makes me happy enough
I will look at every individual ingredient and their PH Value

[Charlene]

vitalys said:

@CHarley Candida and Aspergillus are not bacteria. Thus, you need to fortify your antifungal spectrum of the preservative system. 

Thank you and my bad 
 
I will read around that 

And Excuse my English it’s my second language 

[Charlene]

PhilGeis said:

As Pharma is spot on.
Natacide is a proprietary mixture.  You should NOT use anything as preservative whose composition is not known and specified in CoA.  The preservative is the only ingredient used exclusively for a safety purpose in your product, and you should not delegate safety to Synerga.

Do not use this stuff..

Thank you for your opinion 

[Charlene]

MarkBroussard said:

@CHarley:

I sounds like the real issue is that your product is not properly preserved, more than a manufacturing issue or a Naticide issue.  Without any further information, it really is not possible to give you any further advice:

Is this an emulsified product?
What is your final pH?
Are you using any preservative boosters, chelating agents and/or co-preservatives?
What two organisms caused your PET to fail?

Thank you for your response 
Yes it is an emulsified product
The final PH is 7.2 and I don’t use any other preservatives or boosters seen the supplier mention this:”Its broad spectrum activity allows it to be the only preservative needed in a cosmetic formulation. “

The bacteria they found are Candida albicans and Aspergillus brasiliensis.