[belassi]

Hydroquinone is banned in the E.U.

[belassi]

Completely agree with @chemicalmatt. When adding fragrance to my sulphate-free shampoo I always add it directly to the sodium cocoamphoacetate, which is an excellent emulsifier, then blend well, then add that to the other surfactants and blend again. I don’t need to add polysorbate and in fact I do not like polysorbate in shampoo, it’s a real foam-killer.

[belassi]

Probably your surfactants are not good emulsifiers.

[belassi]

Yes, agreed, @milliachemist. I do recall in my early days experimenting with mixtures of anionic and cationic, and getting disasters. 

I have a possible solution to mind. Forget using the cationic. Anyway the betaine has a cation in it. If you would like great conditioning (it looks to me like you’re trying to design a 2-in-1) then add say 2% of Polyquart H-81. It is a pseudo-cationic and plays well with anionic shampoos. Instead of the CETAC use say, an amphoteric such as sodium cocoamphoacetate, an excellent mild amphoteric with good foam and thickening properties.

[belassi]

The AOS40 is anionic; the glucoside is anionic; the betaine is amphoteric; the CETAC (I have never heard of any of these except betaine) is anionic! That will be enough to cause a mess.

[belassi]

Liquid Germall Plus at 5% ????

Should be 0.5% max!

[belassi]

You can easily get 0.5% error just by the meniscus observation alone. I use a range of graduated cylinders but I would never trust my volume accuracy. I use the scales for everything.

[belassi]

Yes, sorry. Texapon Foamaster.

[belassi]

Sulphate free usually means salt free, too, since salt doesn’t thicken these surfactants. It’s far easier to make multipurpose (conditioning) versions since cationic compounds play well with amphoteric surfactants. Yes they are a lot more expensive to make, because the surfactants cost more and the thickener is expensive.

My own range of sulphate-free shampoo is based on Kao’s surfactants. I really like them.

Is anyone else here using Kao Chemicals surfactants?

[belassi]

I have both sodium benzoate and potassium sorbate, and have used both to preserve shampoos, but have standardised on sorbate due to the irritation potential of benzoate.

[belassi]

Foamaster (Texopon) might be of interest?

[belassi]

Here in Mexico I can buy any quantity I want of pretty much anything, including pure ethanol. I suppose people don’t drink it because in the supermarkets one can buy industrial alcohol disguised as a low-quality spirit for next to nothing. I have to say, that 40% alcohol is not something I would ever sell, or put on my skin! 

[belassi]

441 compared with 459 is a 4% error. I really doubt that you can measure that accurately using your measurement technique. This issue is made much more complex by your use of ancient units. The US gallon is different to the Imperial gallon even! This is why we should work only in metric when formulating.

55 US gallons = 208.197L

441 pounds = 200.03Kg

density = 0.961

Which sounds about right for a w/o emulsion.

Since it is an emulsion the density can never equal 1 because oils have a typical density of around 0.9

Measuring using cups or similar is hopelessly inaccurate.

[belassi]

So, they’re using the properties of propolis, a bee-produced resin, in this. I experimented with propolis, but I found the solubility problems were enough to put me off using it. Usually it’s supplied as a tincture with an alcohol base.

[belassi]

First, it appears to me as if the ingredients list is out of order, because I don’t think that CAPB would be lower in the list than, say, hydrolysed wheat protein! It appears to be a SLES/CAPB surfactant mixture so I would expect the CAPB to be at least 10% of this product while the wheat protein would likely be 1% or 2% at most.

Secondly, regarding preservatives, Propolis extract is a known antiseptic product and preservative (how to incorporate what is basically an oil soluble resin in a shampoo isn’t something I would like to tackle, though).

Climbazole is an anti-fungal which might (I really don’t know) offer preservation against common things like A.Niger. I suspect (without Googling it) that the essential oil of cedar may also offer antibacterial/antifungal activity.

[belassi]

Fine. I will ask him when I see him. He spends a lot of his time in Chiapas where they mine the different clays. Apparently the quality is second only to the French green clay. There are a lot of volcanics here; zeolites are another substance that’s mined, but I don’t have a use for that. This clay is lovely though. I tried it myself of course; it left my skin super-hydrated and soft.

[belassi]

You’re most welcome. BTW I have another good reason not to use lactic acid: it is one of the glycolic acids (exfoliating) and even though it is the least active of these, glycolic acids are known to cause unpleasant brown staining of the skin when exposed to sunlight.

[belassi]

That hadn’t occurred to me. I have to see him soon as we are running out. He gave me around 2Kg as a sample. I will ask. He did mention that some people eat it as a mineral supplement. Apparently it is graded as suitable for that, too.

[belassi]

Try adding the Leucidal to the rose hydrosol and see if a colour change occurs. Many organic solutions change colour with pH - such as red cabbage! But I wouldn’t worry, the colour sounds fine anyway.

[belassi]

@Antoinette: Where would on get this type of clay combo? I only see individual clays sold at online suppliers.

I’m lucky in that I found a guy who owns a mine in Chiapas. They mine these minerals and then have them milled to a very fine consistency.

Previously I bought a couple of Kilos of green bentonite from another supplier. I found that it was too coarsely grained and wouldn’t “spread” on the face but tended to fall off in lumps. Also, it caused a pronounced ‘heating’ effect. The combination of clays doesn’t have these problems.

[belassi]

Interesting story Bob! Thanks!

[belassi]

Could be a component acting as an indicator. What pH is the emulsion? I’ve noticed something similar using tea extract. By the way, grapefruit seed extract is not a recognised or effective preservative. 

The web site states: While it has only a slight odor, it will impart some color to clear cosmetic products, although it is still possible to formulate “white” emulsions.

[belassi]

What worries me, actually, is that the first product I designed is a hand cream, and it is becoming increasingly popular, customers have recently told me they love it because of the smell. Unthinkingly I used one of the fake famous aromas when I first made it. You can see where that’s going. 

[belassi]

I think the caprylyl glycol and ethylhexylglycerin are the likely items, I suspect that this is the preservative, something similar to Spectrastat or Spectraguard, used at about 0.7% typically. This is an anti-wrinkle preparation? I make an enzymatic exfoliant gel using Spectrastat as the preservative and even with no fragrance it has a pleasant mild aroma.

[belassi]

Can’t find much “officially published” data for Neem. For thyme, yes - I use it as an anti-acne ingredient since it has been proven to kill acne propionis - eg

Strong antiseptic activity of essential oils has been known for a long time. The antibacterial activity of oils was tested against clinical bacterial strains of Staphylococcus, Enterococcus, Escherichia and Pseudomonas genera. The agar diffusion method was used for microbial growth inhibition at various concentrations of the oils from T. vulgaris and L. angustifolia. Susceptibility testing to antibiotics and chemotherapeutics was carried out using disc-diffusion method. 120 strains of bacteria isolated from patients with infections of oral cavity, respiratory, genitourinary tracts and from hospital environment were investigated. The results of experiments showed that the oil from T. vulgaris exhibited extremely strong activity against all of the clinical strains. Thyme oil demonstrated a good efficacy against antibiotics resistant strains of the tested bacteria. ref: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22313307

I suggest those of us who don’t have to worry about US regulations might make use of this. I certainly do; there is no way I am going to damage the environment by using something like triclosan.