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Would borax and cera bellina work as an emulsifier?
or does borax only work with cera alba?
and would you suggest adding soy lethicin to to this?
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21 Replies
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borax is a category 1B reprotoxin, personally I’d avoid it altogether
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ok thanks bill!
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There is nothing magic about borax as an emulsifier.
It gets its reputation from being the emulsifier, together with beeswax, in the traditional cold cream which was supposedly invented by the Ancient Greeks, in particular, Galen - the “father” of medicine. Borax is found in natural deposits worldwide.
Borax has an alkaline reaction and will react with acids: thus the acids in beeswax react forming a soap which is the emulsifying agent, not the borax per se.
Since the controversy about the safety of borax (whether real or imagined) began, the large maufacturers of beeswax/borax products have been busy reformulating to remove borax e.g Unilever have reformulated Pond’s Cold Cream and replaced borax with sodium hydroxide.
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@johnb the concern is very real, and arose from its classification under the Globally Harmonised System of chemical classification (which was passed into European law in 2008)
because of this, it’s been classified as a Substance of Very High Concern under REACh regulations, which means there is a legal requirement for its usage to be tightly monitored, and for its usage in place of less contentious alternatives to be justified
in thise case, the branders clearly felt the case for continued use wasn’t strong enough, and it was simpler to use an alternative material that did the same job
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Bill, the real point of my post was to clarify that there is nothing magic about borax as an emulsifier and that it can be readily replaced with other materials e.g NaOH, as Unilever have done.
Please don’t think I am championiing borax as a cosmetic material because I am not.
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From what I’ve read up on it the classification of is as toxic is overhyped, unless consuming large quantities orally it’s going to do no harm, at worst a slight bit of irritation to sensitive skin if used in a lotion.
My question is though, will it react with Cera bellina to create an emulsifying soap or will the fact Cera Bellina has been processed affect this?
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If you’re so interested you should try it.
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I will but it would be helpful to know beforehand…after all that’s what this forum is for right? Help with formulating?
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gregwhite There are some occasions when the questions posed in enquiries are new and for whatever reason there is currrently no answer.
It is apparent to me that what you are are asking is one of those questions and nobody that has read this thread has tried to carry out the procedure you want to know about - hence the reply from Belassi
It will help fill the pool of world knowledge if you do try it yourself and report your findings on this forum.
Whatever you think about the properties of borax, there are worldwide restrictions on its use. Those of us with commercial interests must heed this, no matter what their personal view - hence my own comments.
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i tried reducing cera alba and cera bellina to 7% and the emulsion seems fine, so not entirely sure tbh but it seems ok even if just reacting with the cera alba at 7%.
with regards to worldwide restrictions on borax do you have any brief info on this? i know there are restrictions in place under the EU here, but only on the sale of it, not the use of it in products (there may be a limit to % allowed in a product, but i am only using it at <1%)
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Regarding Borax the EU doesn’t seem to able to make up their mind. It is a CMR substance and therefore forbidden in cosmetics according to article 15 of regulation. However it is still allowed according to Annex III.- I have send >10 Emails asking them a simple question: Is borax banned? No answer what so ever. (they usually answer my Emails) grrr!
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I will but it would be helpful to know beforehand
- Not really, no. There is no substitute for hands-on trials. I could write 1,000 words and still not convey what “short-flow” means as compared with you making some short flow gel and feeling the sensorials. -
with regards to worldwide restrictions on borax do you have any brief
info on this? i know there are restrictions in place under the EU here,
but only on the sale of it, not the use of it in products (there may be a
limit to % allowed in a product, but i am only using it at <1%)The amount of information available on this subject is too large for me to give a reasonable précis. Remember that Google is your friend and your access to it is the same as mine.
Please note also my earlier reply:
the large maufacturers of beeswax/borax products have been busy
reformulating to remove borax e.g Unilever have reformulated Pond’s Cold
Cream and replaced borax with sodium hydroxide. -
@johnb I have done a fair amount of research online about regulations of borax in products, I cant seem to find if there is a minimum amount that requires specific warning labels to be included on packaging. For Boric Acid in the EU it is 5.5%, and it seems there is a minimum % on borax too but i cant find it, any idea?
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You must be using a different Google to the one I use
http://europeanmovement.eu/news/borates-banned-in-the-eu-without-exception/
http://www.mtib.gov.my/techalert/3-2007/RioTinto.pdf
https://www.personalcaremagazine.com/Handlers/FileHandler.ashx?fileId=15156https://echa.europa.eu/…/opinion-on-the-use-of-boric-acid-and-borate-compounds
https://ec.europa.eu/health/scientific_committees/consumer_safety/…/sccs_o_146.pdfEt cetera
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@johnb I fully agree with you: the purpose of my post was to provide additional information about why the major branders did what they did
@David given that a number of national authorities within the EU have impounded products containing perborates, and barred them from sale on the grounds that perborate and borate salts are category 1 reprotoxins (see RAPEX reports for details), I’d personally err on the side of caution and steer well clear of them
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@Bill_Toge what does it mean “err and steer well”? Perborates I can understand but borax?
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What is this obsession with borate compounds?
As I remarked above, there is nothing magic about using borates as emulsifiers.
There are plenty of other, better, materials that can be used as emulsifiers and sodium hydroxide in a suitable aliquot, can directly replace borax quite successfully in almost all instances.
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I am interested
in replacing borax with sodium hydroxide, but how could you calculate
the proportion of hydroxide to neutralize 1 gram of beeswax for example? Is according to the index of acidity? Regards! -
Soapcalc.net
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It isn’t necessary to completely neutralise all of the fatty acids present in beeswax to form an emulsion - it’s probably best not to do so.
The degree of neutralisation will, in most cases, depend on the formulation itself and the effects you want to achieve.
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