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Gliding Effect of Emulsion Despite High Viscosity??
Hello All,
I have a problem nowadays with the rheology-afterfeel of an emulsion I have prepared. It is a very simple traditional O/W emulsion with Carbomer. After emulsify water base and oil phase at 80C, let the mixture cool down to 35-40 C and neutralize with TEA. The final product looks like quite well, rigid and viscous but when you try to pick it up, it is too slippery to handle. When you pick it up and apply to your hand it starts to glide as a bulk not flowing.
Do you have an idea?
Here is the final formulation below.
Oil Phase: Emulgade SE+Lanette D+D5+Paraffinum Liquidum
Water Phase: Aqua+Carbomer+Euxyl PE9010Aqua 86,990 Carbomer 0,250 EMULGADE SE 4,500 LANETTE D / NAFOL 1618 H 1,000 CYCLOPENTASILOXANE 0,400 FRAGRANCE 0,300 EUXYL PE9010 0,800 TEA 0,250 PARAFFINUM LIQUIDUM 5,500 ORGANIC
ALOE VERA GEL0,010 -
11 Replies
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Just wondering, do you mean that it melts slightly and the product slides off your hand?
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Does the emulsion break down when you pick it up with your hand/finger?
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jemolian said:Just wondering, do you mean that it melts slightly and the product slides off your hand?
Hello jemolian
Exactly!
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Kirk said:Does the emulsion break down when you pick it up with your hand/finger?
Hello Kirk.
We cant say break down but it glides like melting butter on the hand.
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@pepe it’s very likely the carbomer is breaking down due to the electrolytes on your hand. Was your hand sweaty? Have you tried washing your hands, drying it and try picking up the product again? It shouldn’t happen if you use a plastic spatula.
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It might be D5 ‘sweating’ because your emulsifier can’t handle silicone oils too well. This effect can result in something which feels like a w/o emulsion and shows such a sliding effect. However, it results in a very fine film of silicone oil on your hands. If you let water run over the ‘slip trace’, it will pearl off.
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jemolian said:@pepe it’s very likely the carbomer is breaking down due to the electrolytes on your hand. Was your hand sweaty? Have you tried washing your hands, drying it and try picking up the product again? It shouldn’t happen if you use a plastic spatula.
@@jemolian This is what I thought actually, my hands are always sweaty. It doesn’t happen when my hands are clean and dry as you said. We can not recommend customers to use this cream just after washing and drying your hands or pick it up with a spoon or smthng like that ::smile:
Is there any recommendation to overcome this problem permanently?
Using Ultrez 20 or 21 which have high tolerance of electrolyte can be useful?Regards,
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@pepe ultrez 20 would be useful but you will have to make a small batch to test if it at least meets your expectations with your hand. Do also note that the viscosity for ultrez 20 may also be lower compared to other grades, so you will have to make some adjustments.
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I was actually about to formulate my first cream with carbomer when I read your post.
I proceed the following way
Aqua Q.S. Carbopol 940 0,250 GLYCERINE 3,000 POLAWAX NF 3,000 CETYL ALCOHOL 1,000 GLYCERYL STEARATE 1,000 IPM 2,000 PARAFFINUM LIQUIDUM 5,000 GERMALL PLUS 0,400 Neutralized with TEA 0.25%
I got the same texture and rheology you described.
On my second attempt, I added 0.10% Xanthan gum and everything else was the same (other than lowering IPM to 1.5%). It seems to have fixed the problem, it gave it just enough “stringiness”. I don’t know if this helps but I thought I would share.
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try adding more cetyl alcohol to it; that’ll give it more viscosity at rest and make it feel ‘thicker’
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Bill_Toge said:try adding more cetyl alcohol to it; that’ll give it more viscosity at rest and make it feel ‘thicker’
After trying several other runs, one with 0.05% Xanthan, in the end it was Bill_Toge’s suggestion that gave the best result.
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