Home Cosmetic Science Talk Formulating Formulating for the Vagina

  • johnb

    Member
    June 15, 2017 at 2:02 pm

    Ah! this has been going on so long, I forgot the orginal brief!

    Referring to the lubricant formula, does it contain 42% of PG? or is that a typo?

    If 42% is correct then it may be better to use Klucel as the viscosifier in preference to Natrosol. Klucel has much better solubility in polar organic solvents (alcohols, glycols) than has Natrosol.

  • Chemist5000

    Member
    June 15, 2017 at 3:00 pm

    @MarkBroussard
    Thank you so much! :)   The 20 Kg pilot is to make the formal stability and preservative challenge for the product.  Plus they want to send samples to a prospective customer.  

    I was doing “quicky” stability (40°C and 55°C) during my formulation to give me idea if the product will separate.  I wasn’t going to use this as formal stability. Surprisingly all the big wigs are on board with doing formal stability since they have had so much issue with it in the past.  My company one of those companies that started out good ( approx 30 y/o) then changed owners (several times) and priorities. Ultimately vital procedures and quality GMP were dumped in lieu of making a buck.  Slowly they are now trying to get back on the wagon.  Still fighting to get some things back in place.  They are CHEAP!

    We are catching all kinds of crap from the FDA with the 510K for one of our products.  Not really my concern at this moment. :)

    Much like you know till the chemicals come in for the pilot….my next project is to do a clitoris gel and to reformulate another lube…

  • Chemist5000

    Member
    June 15, 2017 at 3:11 pm

    @johnb
    42% PG is correct.  I looked at a few competitors and they had PG in the top 3 ingredients.  I have noticed some solubility issues with using Natrosol 250 HHR.  I have ordered Natrosol H to experiment with too.  I will get some Klucel. Thanks for the tip!!!

  • Chemist5000

    Member
    June 15, 2017 at 3:16 pm

    Coconut Oil!
    I have seen several products using near 100% coconut oil as a lube by itself.  If a preservative was added would that be better?  I have seen this also in the THC/CBD where coconut oil is infused and sold as a lubricant.  Any thoughts.

  • johnb

    Member
    June 15, 2017 at 3:23 pm

    Coconut oil and latex are a definite no-no.

  • markbroussard

    Member
    June 15, 2017 at 3:37 pm

    Double @johnb commentary … No coconut oil.

    @doctorbrenda provided you with a very good synopsis regarding avoiding oils for vaginal products

    Again, Congratulations on your success thus far!

  • AVisotsky

    Member
    July 1, 2017 at 3:31 am

    Late to comment (re: oil in vaginal area) but would like to add my thoughts & politely disagree that oil does not belong to vagina/genitals.
    Here is where I come from:
    1) As a vagina owner, I tried multiple products that are oil based and worked great
    2) Here are some Dr. Opinions:
    http://dirtyorganics.com/do-doctors-recommend-coconut-oil-for-personal-lube/
    3) Here is an article from pubmed:
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24503350

    Would be interested to hear how the argument against oils in/around vagina is substantiated.

  • markbroussard

    Member
    July 1, 2017 at 11:05 am

    Here’s why … because approximately 45% of women who use oils in their vagina end up getting infections.

    http://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/some-popular-vaginal-products-linked-infections-study-finds-f1C8978663

    Your “expert” Dr. Opinion recommended using Coconut Oil (really bad idea) as opposed to water-based vaginal lubricants because she claims they contain Parabens (“and we know Parabens cause cancer” - that is not proven) and Glycerin … She’s presuming that all water-based vaginal lubricants contain Parabens and Glycerin which is clearly not true.  In short, she’s ill informed.

    The NIH study was using encapsulated coconut oil as a carrier for drug delivery … dramatically different that putting Coconut Oil in your vagina as a lubricant.

    Not all women have issues with using oils in the vaginal area, but approximately 50% do get infections from using oil-based products.  In developing a product for the market, an oil-based product is not a market risk I would take.

    Develop a glycerin and paragon-free lube and you address a much larger market segment with minimal issues.

  • markbroussard

    Member
    July 1, 2017 at 11:42 am

    Ask yourself a simple question:

    Does the vaginal cavity naturally contain oils?  No.

    Is the vaginal cavity a naturally aqueous environment?  Yes.

  • AVisotsky

    Member
    July 5, 2017 at 4:53 am

    Hi @MarkBroussard
    If you scroll after the doctor’s opinion there are also 10 other doctors who quoted on the same topic as well as 9 different articles cited. 
    I’d love to read the study you are quoting, do you happen to have a source handy for this data point “Not all women have issues with using oils in the vaginal area, but approximately 50% do get infections from using oil-based products”?
    I assume that it’s a different source that the article you pointed out, since it only says that petrolium jelly users had “Candida” detected, not that they had a candida overgrowth.


  • markbroussard

    Member
    July 5, 2017 at 2:22 pm

    Perhaps you missed this paragraph:

    And 44 percent of women who reported using intravaginal oils tested positive for Candida, the fungus that causes yeast infections, compared to 5 percent of women who did not use oils.

    On its website, the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists recommends that women who need lubricants during sexual activity use water soluble or silicone based products to prevent irritation or sensitivity; silicone-based products tend to be more slippery. ACOG also warns against using petroleum jelly, mineral oil or baby oil with condoms, since these products can cause the condom to break.

    When an “expert” completely ignores an entire class of product, water-based vaginal lubricants that do not contain parabens or glycerin, and instead recommends using oils … and, when those recommendations are counter to the ACOG recommendations, I just stop reading at that point.  BTW:  That “expert” was not a medical doctor, but a sex therapist trained in the psycho-emotional aspects of human sexuality.

  • Loretta

    Member
    July 19, 2023 at 9:54 am

    I don’t know if this a joke, but I hope it is. Made my morning. Thank you

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