Home Cosmetic Science Talk Formulating Differences of Leave in and Wash out conditioner

  • Differences of Leave in and Wash out conditioner

    Posted by curlmaster211 on November 23, 2020 at 1:53 pm

    I have been working on what I hope to be a great deep conditioner but I also want to know what else I can do with it. 

    Currently it is
    70% Water + Silk Amino + DL Panthenol
    17% Emulsifier + Butter
    6% Oil
    Honeyquat
    Fragrance
    Liquid Germall +

    What ratios or chemicals make the difference between a product you leave in or wash off? They all look the same to me unless it has a surfactant
    curlmaster211 replied 3 years, 2 months ago 3 Members · 4 Replies
  • 4 Replies
  • oldperry

    Member
    November 24, 2020 at 1:31 am

    Honestly, you don’t have any ingredients in your formula that would make this a “great” conditioner.  Panthenol, silk amino acids and honeyquat are just claims ingredients.  

    If you want to make a great conditioner you’ll need a cationic surfactant, cationic polymer and a silicone.

  • klangridge

    Member
    November 24, 2020 at 12:05 pm

    @curlmaster211 The largest difference is usually a wash-off will have a higher % of cationic surfactants and oils, and a higher viscosity, because a lot of it will be washed away and the nature of washing dilutes it on the hair. A leave-on product will have lower oil, surfactant and thickeners so it spreads more easily on the hair and doesn’t appear too heavy when the hair is styled. I have been known to massage a very small amount of wash-off conditioner into the lengths of wet hair as a leave-on treatment! 

    Leave-on products might also cut out say 2 of 3 cationic emulsifiers - for example if the wash-off product contains cetearyl alcohol, behenyltrimonium chloride and cetrimonium chloride, the leave-on might just use a lower level of behentrimonium chloride and remove the other two. There are also some ingredients which would not stay well attached to the hair if used in a wash-off product, such as UV absorbers, heat protectants or ingredients which give hold (PVP’s, VP/VA Copolymers etc) which might be more suited to a leave-on styling product.

    An afterthought: @Perry I wonder if they have included the cationics in the “17% emulsifier + butter” to keep the exact formulation private.

  • curlmaster211

    Member
    November 27, 2020 at 2:29 am

    Perry said:

    Honestly, you don’t have any ingredients in your formula that would make this a “great” conditioner.  Panthenol, silk amino acids and honeyquat are just claims ingredients.  

    If you want to make a great conditioner you’ll need a cationic surfactant, cationic polymer and a silicone.

    As this is for curly hair, a silicone wouldn’t be in my best interest for todays market but I have been looking into alternative silicones. This was more like a general starting base before I go wild. I just am confused as to what ingredients separate different sorts of conditioner. I don’t know where to start in regards to chem terms.

  • curlmaster211

    Member
    November 27, 2020 at 2:33 am

    @curlmaster211 The largest difference is usually a wash-off will have a higher % of cationic surfactants and oils, and a higher viscosity, because a lot of it will be washed away and the nature of washing dilutes it on the hair. A leave-on product will have lower oil, surfactant and thickeners so it spreads more easily on the hair and doesn’t appear too heavy when the hair is styled. I have been known to massage a very small amount of wash-off conditioner into the lengths of wet hair as a leave-on treatment! 

    Leave-on products might also cut out say 2 of 3 cationic emulsifiers - for example if the wash-off product contains cetearyl alcohol, behenyltrimonium chloride and cetrimonium chloride, the leave-on might just use a lower level of behentrimonium chloride and remove the other two. There are also some ingredients which would not stay well attached to the hair if used in a wash-off product, such as UV absorbers, heat protectants or ingredients which give hold (PVP’s, VP/VA Copolymers etc) which might be more suited to a leave-on styling product.

    An afterthought: @Perry I wonder if they have included the cationics in the “17% emulsifier + butter” to keep the exact formulation private.

    That’s the most help I have been able to receive in weeks, thank you for your take. & you are correct there is a lot going into the conditioner that I left out I just wanted to include the more chemical-y ingredients rather than list all 20+ herbs and butters and whatnots

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