PhilGeis
Forum Replies Created
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Test your “rancid” product. Unless you find contamination doubt if you need a preservative with that formula.
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cap2 preser vative - think you’re wasting your money.
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W-in Si oil emulsions do not test well in classic preservative tests - failure does NOT mean they are susceptible. Strongly recommend you get a copy of the article cited below.
Schnittger, S., Sabourin, J. and King, D., 2002. Preservation of water-in-silicone emulsions. JOURNAL OF COSMETIC SCIENCE, 53(1), pp.78-80.
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Not aware the term ‘revalidation” in this context. ALL cosmetics should be marketed with challenge testing data justifying their microbiological safety through consumer use - tho’ consumer can use stuff forever and do not respect ex dates - most major companies see three years in this regard and use “rapid ageing” of product to project preservative stability and efficacy.
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The culture the product - find if a microorganism also contaminating.
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Parabens will do nothing for oxidation. Unless you;ve seen or cultured microbial contamination, a preservative is piob not necessary. Look at labels of similar products.
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How much water? Have you seen any mold or other microbial contamination?
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Please be aware - even if one takes supplier as truthful - this stuff is not “natural” but a chemical derivative of the claimed extract.
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Parabens can offer a burning sensation in taste.
Are you sure you need a preservative? Can you share your formula? -
What supplier? And who is their supplier?
Suggest you inquire as to their response to reports from Japan, US dpt ag. and Europe that the stuff has been amended with commercial disinfectants, triclosan and parabens.
“Suppliers”were responsible so asking suppliers for data as CoA may not bring the best information.As microfomulation implied - why not use an ingredient with a clean record?
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This is not about performance but an adulterated product. Even without that considertion, it’s hardly reasonable to assume the supplier salted the mine only for ONLY for its antimicrobial efficacy.
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Added as humectant?
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It is a scam - do not use this junk in any application..
https://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/govi/pharmaz/2007/00000062/00000008/art00007
https://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/jf0514064 -
Me too Perry. Here’s what they say about % -
The agency has reviewed the
recommended concentrations of
colloidal oatmeal reported in the
literature and reference texts (Refs. 4, 29
through 32, 34 through 45, 47, 48, and
49) and has considered the range ofoncentrations for colloidal oatmeal
used in bath additive products and in
other dosage forms. Products containing
colloidal oatmeal have been formulated
in the following dosage forms: Lotion (1
and 10 percent colloidal oatmeal),
cleansing cream (8 percent colloidal
oatmeal), shampoo (5 percent colloidal
oatmeal), and cleansing bars (30, 50, and
51 percent colloidal oatmeal) (Refs. 4,
46, and 47). The agency has calculated
the approximate minimum and
maximum concentrations of colloidal
oatmeal that have been used as follows:
For regular colloidal oatmeal, a range of
0.023 to 0.625 percent when used as a
tub bath soak (Refs. 29, 34 through 38,
and 44), a range of 0.24 to 1.2 percent
when used as a foot bath soak (Refs. 30,
31, and 34), a range of 0.24 to 15 percent
in aqueous solution when used in a wet
pack (Refs. 30, 31, 32, 34, and 45), and
a range of 3.75 to 15 percent in aqueous
solution when used as a topical lotion
(Refs. 30, 32, and 34); for oilated
colloidal oatmeal, a range of 0.003 to
0.03 percent when used as a tub bath
soak (Refs. 35 and 39 through 43). -
From OTC Skin Protectant Monograph (https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/FR-2003-06-04/pdf/03-13751.pdf)
(f) Colloidal oatmeal, 0.007 percent
minimum; 0.003 percent minimum in
combination with mineral oil in
accordance with § 347.20(a)(4).(g) Dimethicone, 1 to 30 percent
(l) Mineral oil, 50 to 100 percent; 30
to 35 percent in combination with
colloidal oatmeal in accordance with
§ 347.20(a)(4). -
emma - have you challenged phases separately and through cycles of shaking?
Think you’re approach preserves the oil/water interface more so than the preserving the oil phase per se.
Don’t presume the product is biphasic by intent. They may not have been able to establish stable emlusion. -
Marina - did the original prroduct have a PAO?
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Glyceryl’s undecylenate and caprylate with or without gluconate is a lousy system. any idea pH?
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Evolution is not rationale. Sebum secretion, oily hair et al. are not the results of reasoning or purpose satisfaction. They are the result of evolution, and their maintenance in current humans may or may not be based on some function we can observe. Might be remanant or result of some obsolete function.
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Re. 3. Real weak system - you need more than that.
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Abdullah said:The question i think about several times a day is what does the companies that sell the largest amount of beauty products for example Shampoo do that people are buying there Products instead of there competitors?
The simple answers that every one would give is good marketing or good quality or affordable price. But this is not the right answer. If you do good job at these parts your sells will not increase or increase for a short time and then decrease again to the level before.
So what are they doing or have done that they have succeeded this much?
You +/- describe P&G’s basic practice that has been successful globally with Pantene and Head&Shoulders - quality with effective product and advertising/ marketing. Tho’ can add continued product improvements/”news’ - real or contrived.
What may not be evident is the “effective” element both for product development and advertising/marketing. Knowing consumers - what they want and what appeals to them - as well a investing in the technology so products are (and perceived as) more effective. There are peripheral elements shelf placement , response to consumer complaints, active patent defense, etc. -
Be consistent in your practice but be aware 1:10 dilution of your product is not your product.
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Yup - bunch of jerks.
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45 kg. Dang. Supplier contract with the jerks didn’t offer any help?
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Don’t understand why they make such a big deal of CoA. Did they offere that one for cosmetics?