OldPerry
Forum Replies Created
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Wikipedia. Good point @bobzchemist
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The best place to get that information is from suppliers of the raw materials. You might be able to find most of what you need in the INCI Directory.
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As a general rule of thumb Carbomer gives the best clarity. HEC and Xanthan gums are usually a little hazy They also do not have the suspending power of Carbomer. So you could make a flowable Carbomer thickened liquid that would also suspend things like gelatin beads in it.
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Required HLB is the HLB needed to emulsify an oil. It is determined experimentally. You can find a list of them and how they were determined in this link.
The The HLB number is an indication of the percentage weight of the hydrophilic portion of the nonionic emulsifier molecule. Thus, if a nonionic emulsifier were 100% hydrophilic, you would expect it to have an HLB of 100. But it’s easier to deal with smaller numbers so everything is divided by 5 making the maximum HLB value of any material 20.
Required HLB refers to oilsHLB value refers to emulsifiers -
@milliachemist - lol
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@milliachemist - Think of it this way. The base molecule has a certain solubility in water. When you add PEG it increases the solubility.
So PEG 12 Dimethicone is more water soluble than say PEG 8 Dimethicone but less soluble than PEG 20 dimethicone.Similarly, PEG 8 Distearate is less water soluble than PEG 150 Distearate.But it makes no sense to compare water solubility of PEG 12 Dimethicone to PEG 150 Distearate -
And website information would be nice too.
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Yes, we would need a better idea of what else is in the formula to answer such a question.
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When a product claims “sulfate free” they mean there is no surfactant with the word sulfate in it’s name (e.g. Sodium Lauryl Sulfate, Ammonium Lauryl Sulfate, or Sodium Laureth Sulfate)
But like @Bobzchemist said, it’s a marketing gimmick. -
I’m not sure what your business model is. Are you marketing cosmetics? Are you hiring formulators to make products then sell those yourself?
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My suggestion is to continue to use Carbopol thickener. It will improve your stability too.
Why do you want to not use Carbopol? -
Do you want to start making your own product line or are you looking to just to make a product for your own use?
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Hello @cherri - sorry I just saw this message
I’ll let you know when I’m out there next time.RegardsPerry, 44PS. What did you think of the show? -
I doubt there is an acceptable list. Just an unacceptable list.
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@DavidW - my first job out of college was as a formulator and I didn’t even know that personal care products were considered cosmetics. I thought cosmetic chemist meant that I made lipstick, eyeshadow and nail polish.
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Congratulations!!
Just be open to learning everything you can. Also, while it is important to learn to be a good cosmetic scientist it’s also extremely helpful in business to learn people skills. That is learn how to get along with people and make them like you. Some people have a natural talent for this but everyone can continue to work on it. In truth, I found the book ‘How to Win Friends and Influence People’ incredibly helpful in business.But from the chemistry point of view, learn how to make every formula you can at the company. Try to understand what the ingredients do and even think of ways that you can make things less expensive.Most of all, have fun! -
Or you could try a different acid like HCl. That might make too much salt but could bring it down to 7 or 8 without having to add as much. Just test it in a small batch first.
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Hello Peggy,
The most important thing when marketing a cosmetic or personal care product is to come up with some unique story. You can have a successful brand with standard technologies and standard claims. Of course, it’s better if you could come up with some nifty claim but in skin care all the impressive ones are taken by the big corporations.Here are a few approaches you could take to the story.1. Make products for a niche audience - Find an audience that the big guys are ignoring or that is too small for them to care about. An example would be skin care for people with gluten sensitivities. I’m not saying that’s a good market to go for but it’s an example of a targeted market who might want something that they’re not getting from mainstream products. Groups of people like to feel special.2. Create a clever origin story - Lots of brands have done this and have had some success. Burts Bees was the story of how Burt started his personal care products. Tom’s of Maine is another example. Those happen to be natural focused brands but the story doesn’t have to be natural focused, just interesting.3. Clever brand image - Another brand that was super successful without a novel technology or claim was Urban Decay. Their products aren’t different but they were able to create a compelling brand image. They started in 1996 and just sold to L’Oreal for >$150 million.To me, the story is more important than the claims. You need great products that support standard claims but a good story is crucial to a successful line. -
yeah, it depends on what else is in your formula.
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@milliachemist - good point. The concentrate will have to be preserved. But if the product passes a challenge test prior to filling in the aerosol, I would think it wouldn’t need a preservative when put under pressure as this would be an air-tight environment.
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For an aerosol product with a significant amount of alcohol, why do you need an additional preservative?
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Hello @shahbaz,
@milliachemist is right. Sometimes people just don’t have an answer to a question or they don’t see it or they are too busy to answer. And other times people who have the expertise don’t necessarily want to share an answer because they depend on this knowledge to make a living.My reason for not answering is that I just got too busy to give you a proper answer. Plus you were asking for pretty detailed stuff complete with online links to sources. This is a bit much. While some of the answers you get on this forum might be pretty detailed, you can’t expect that someone is going to go through and search the Internet for supporting links and detailed explanations to answer a question for which they aren’t getting paid. Some cosmetic consultants get paid >$500 an hour to answer questions like these.Anyway, to answer your question about testing see this blog post I did about cosmetic tests you must run before launching your product.Perhaps some day when I get more time I will write a more detailed version of this post but for the moment, that’s the best I’ve got.It really is nothing personal. But you can see there are literally hundreds of discussions / questions going on in this forum. People answer things that are easy to answer or they are really interested in answering. And the reality is that there is nothing else like this forum anywhere else on the Internet. I’m just happy we get any answers to questions like these.Hope that helps!Perry, 44 -
Hello @lolo - we are going to be re-launching the Cosmetic Launch Coach program in the fall after the Practical Cosmetic Formulating course is finished.
Perry, 44 -
It would help if you could give us an idea of the ingredients in the formula & what the formula is used for.
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I was assuming he was trying to save a batch but you are correct, adding less salt would work (and would be the preferred method).