ozgirl
Forum Replies Created
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Talk to your distributor and see if another local company is buying the product that you want in bulk and would be willing to repackage a small amount for you. You will often pay a bit more for this but it would be cheaper than a reseller. We have been on both sides of this before and it works well.
For one product we only wanted a small amount (~15kg) for a one off project and couldn’t get it in less than a 200kg drum. So we convinced the distributor to order us in 30 x 500gram samples and paid for the samples. It was a bit of hassle but meant that we weren’t left with 185kg of product that we didn’t want.
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Have a look at the Lubrizol website. They have lots of formulations for skin care gels that might give you some good ideas.
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Here are a couple of thinks to consider.
What type of products would you be formulating? If it is basic shampoo, conditioner, body wash and lotion type products it could probably be done as there are plenty of starting formulations out there that you can use and modify to suit your needs. You should definitely join up to the Prospector (formerly Innovadex) website.
I would also find out more about what they expect of a “natural” cosmetics line. If you need to avoid certain preservatives (e.g. parabens or formaldehyde donors) or classes of ingredients (e.g.sulphates, palm oil ingredients etc) it is going to make your job much more difficult as it can take weeks to research and test alternatives.
You also need to consider what types of ingredients you will have readily available in your area. Some ingredients can take up to 12-14 weeks to get to you after they are ordered. This is probably difficult to know without taking the job and talking to suppliers but it is definitely worth considering.
I personally think it is a pretty tight time frame but it could be done. I would ask what the outcome would be if you can’t meet that deadline. Is this an existing company that is introducing an additional product line that could push back the deadline by a couple of months or is it a new company that must have things done by a certain deadline?
Best wishes if you decide to take the job.
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I have used Honeyquat 50 which is a quaternary conditioning derivative of honey.
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This is an ASTM International standard (ASTM D2330-02) and you should be able to purchase the standard which will contain the method.
You might also be able to find it in a library that has copies of the ASTM standards.
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@Bismide. Your calculations are correct.
The 15% active matter formula in the article is just a suggestion for a medium quality dishwashing liquid. If you are making an economy formula you could go with a lower percentage of active surfactant matter.
Maybe try starting by making a sample with 15% ASM to see if this improves your foaming and then decrease the amount ASM until you get to a cost that is acceptable but foaming that is still ok.
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Here is an old article from HAPPI that might give you some ideas.
http://www.happi.com/issues/2011-03/view_features/formulating-manual-dishwash-detergents/As you have identifed your low foaming issue is probably due to low active surfactant material. What concentration of actives do the SLES and Cocamidopropyl betaine that you are using have? The formula you have given is similar to one in the article (see link) but in the article it refers to 4% active SLES which would actually be 16% of a 25% active SLES in the formula or 5.7% of a 70% active SLES. Similarly Cocamidopropyl betaine is usually sold as a 30% or 45% active solution. Check you actual active levels of your surfactants and adjust your formula accordingly.
Once you have adjusted your formula (if necessary) to account for the different active levels of your surfactants and you find you still need to increase your active matter start by increasing the SLES and /or the sulphonic acid surfactants first as these are most likely to contribute to foaming and are probably also the cheapest.
I would also suggest not using Cocamide DEA because it is now classified as a possible carcinogen due to the DEA content. Try using Cocamide MEA instead as it has similar properties with no carcinogenicity issues.
Hope this helps
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Not sure if you are interested in a blend but Evonik sell blends of Ceramides with cholesterol under the trade names Skinmimics and SK-influx-V.
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The distearyldimonium chloride would be the emulsifier. It is sold under the trade name Varisoft TA 100 (Evonik).
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The undeceth-11 and undeceth-5 are ethoxylated surfactants used to emulsify the silicones. They have different HLB values. The reason two undeceth surfactants are used is the same reason we use two different HLB emulsifers when making a cream or lotion.
Here is an article that might be of interest.
http://www.dowcorning.com/content/publishedlit/22-1746.pdf
Hope this helps
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There may be some starting formulations of interest to you on the Lubrizol website
https://www.lubrizol.com/PersonalCare/Formulations/Sunscreens.html
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Thanks chemicalmatt for the information
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Thanks for the suggestions! I will give them a try.
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You could try a glycol ether solvent such as Dowanol DPM (INCI: PPG-2 Methyl Ether) if you want to stay away from alcohol. I have seen this used in an alcohol free perfume formulation with PEG-40 HCO to help solubilise the fragrance. From memory it was used at about 5%.
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Can you add some ethanol or other water soluble solvent to help solubilize your active?
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These tables might be useful for you
http://lxsrv7.oru.edu/~alang/onsc/solubility/allsolvents.php?solute=salicylic%20acid
http://www.asiapharmaceutics.info/viewimage.asp?img=AsianJPharm_2010_4_1_60_63981_t2.jpg
Hope this helps
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Have a look at Dow Cornings website. They have starting formulations for all sorts of automotive polishes.
http://www.dowcorning.com/content/formulations/formulations.aspIf you want a milky sprayable polish also have a look at stainless steel polish and furniture polish formulations for ideas.
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Some basic etiquette like introducing yourself, not using capital letters, being polite when asking questions,etc would be good to include in general forum guidelines.
Other guidelines might include:
If asking for formulation help, give some information about the formula rather than just a vague description of the problem. eg. “Help - my lotion separated when I added xxx raw material” is not going to get many responses other than “what else is in the formulation”. Whereas “Help - my lotion separated when I added abc raw material. The lotion also contains x,y & z. I added abc to the cool down phase” is going to get more responses. You don’t need to give exact percentages of each ingredient if you don’t want to, although this may help you get the answer you require.If people respond to your request for help. Make a post in the thread thanking/acknowledging them.
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@millachemist I am also seeing the pattern hence my advice to the original poster to slow down and learn something. I won’t be offering any further help.
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Why are you making 10 litre batches of products that you obviously have no experience with? Where are you getting your starting formulations? A quick google search of “carageenan air freshener formulation” gives a number of formulations from reutable suppliers that would give you a great starting point.
I am assuming that when you refer to “sulphurnic” you are actually referring to sulphuric acid. I have no idea why you would include that at all in this formulation. You have 15% fragrance in your formula with no solubiliser (surfactant) so it is no wonder that you are getting separation. Most fragrances are not water soluble and in the couple of starting formulations I looked at the fragrance concentrations were at around 2.5%.
Looking at your other posts it is clear that you are trying to make large batches with no experience and really just wasting your money. My suggestion would be to slow down and learn something about the products you wish to make, look for starting formulations, learn about the function of the raw materials you will need to use, start with small test batches, and then eventually after much trial and error come up with a product that will be suitable for your needs. Even experienced formulators would follow a similar procedure.
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The preservative ingredients in this formula are probably the caprylyl glycol and the Honeysuckle extract.
Caprylyl Glycol has some antimicrobial activity and honeysuckle extract contains ‘natural’ parabens.
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Do you have any information on what chemical/s in the leaf are the active constituents? You will need to extract these actives into a useable form (or purchase an existing extract of this plant if it exists) and then create a deodorant formulation based on this extract. You will then need to test the efficacy of your product as a deodorant. I am not sure of the UK regulations but I am assuming that if you are creating a new extract there will need to be some type of registration and safety testing.
This is assuming that you are planning to make a commercial type deodorant and are not just planning to sell leaves to people.
Hope this helps
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When formulating it is advisable to start by making small batches (100 to 500g) to test a formula rather than trying to make 5kg straight away. Also when providing a formula for comment/assistance it is easier for others to comment if it is given in percentages and with the INCI names.
Definitely check out swiftcraftmonkeys blog, she has a lot of very useful information for people who are just starting out with formulating. I would advise trying to make some of the formulas that she has on her blog before starting to create your own formulas.
Cetrimonium Chloride is good for detangling.
Hope this helps.
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New Directions Australia sells 100cs dimethicone. It is not the 6cps you are currently using but it might be good enough.
The only way to tell if replacement ingredients will work is to test them.
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Perhaps the easier thing to do would be to find a different solubilizer. Maybe you should ask your supplier of the polysorbates what they would recommend.