MarkBroussard
Forum Replies Created
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Since you are already adding a heavy dose of Gluconolactone, why don’t you use Gluconolactone (and) Sodium Benzoate which is also EcoCert
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Yes, it has poor solubility relative to Sodium Ascorbyl Phosphate and leaves a white film on the skin when the product dries. Use SAP and you won’t have these problems. MAP is a nightmare to work with relative to SAP and has no appreciable benefit over SAP.
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@Cafe:
Well, the simple issue is: How are they going to patent intellecutal property that they do not own? You would have to consent, but, if you are already selling these product to other consumers, then the products/composition is already in the public domain and is therefore not patentable.
Another thing you are learning about wealthy individuals as clients: You don’t necessarily have to be terribly intelligent to become very wealthy.
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That’s probably because this ingredient may have a peptide sequence that is very similar to, or the same as, the peptide sequence found in a particular fragment of Human Type 1 Collagen and it makes a compelling marketing story
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The question is: What exactly is it that you are developing the they think is patentable? You are not granted a patent just because you apply for one … you must have something unique. Perhaps best to just let them consult with a patent attorney and let him advise on the patentability of your formulas.
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I’m going to start selling Cosmetics Eggs injected with Polyquat-10 in the hair care section of the supermarket … great idea!
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Stanley, look at it from this perspective: This is an open forum … anyone can join and ask whatever questions they are seeking answers to and anyone can provide answers. You can’t control that. Some professionals in the forum take pride in answering as many questions as they can. Others, like me, answer primarily if the poster seems to be sincere in their quest to learn more and I feel like sharing information with them.
What you can control is whether or not, or how much, of your years of hard work studying, working in the lab perfecting your craft, you are willing to share with posters. Lots of time you can actually learn new things from the questions posted by novices because you have not thought about it that way or had not encountered that particular problem or someone has made you aware of an ingredient that you had not heard of before. So, my perspective is that there is something that can be learned from both professionals and novices on this forum.
Simple fact of life: You don’t necessarily have to be a trained chemist to be successful in the personal care business.
I think Perry can probably guide you to a couple of paid forums that are for chemists and industry professionals only.
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There’s a couple of things you will learn about wealthy individuals as clients. They can be difficult to deal with, on occassion, because they have grown accustomed to people catering to them because they are wealthy or because they have the money to do whatever they want to.
Most importantly, they did not get wealthy by throwing away money and can be quite tight with it. You simply have to tolerate any eccentricities, to an extent, and treat them like you do every other client. They will always respect you if you stick to making good, logical business decisions with sound reasoning as opposed to pandering to their whims.
Focus on the products … if he wants Ginger in the shampoo, do it … it doesn’t matter what he’s wearing, just keep your attention focused on the products.
I once got trapped for a week by a potential client in his private compound at the top of a mountain overlooking the ocean above Malibu. I walked away from the business opportunity because it was not worth the headache of dealing with someone so wealthy, yet very cheap, and eccentric. At the end of the day, every client’s money is green, so don’t get seduced by the fact that someone has a lot of it because they will pay you for your work at market rate, but certainly not any more than market rate.
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There’s a really good reason why these free formulas never become commercial products.
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I developed the IroIro product line … are you looking to develop products for the European market or US market … the dyes allowed in each are quite different. The regulations in Europe are much more stringent.
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Betaine will hydrate the hair … good ingredient to use in “Moisturizing” shampoos
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@Leo:
3% to 4% Betaine
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Patents … on cosmetic products? … Unless you can come up with something patentable, that’s extraordinarily difficult is cosmetics.
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You need a general business attorney with experience in contract law and have her/him put together for you a basic set of contracts. Of course, you may modify those contracts on occassion. My experience is that I rarely get requests for contract modifications, so if your base contracts are thorough and fair you should be able to use them for virtually all of your clients.
I’ll note that when I have a potential client request contract modifications, it always tells me the client may be difficult to work with and/or their legal counsel does not understand why certain clauses are in the contract. If the potential client is difficult in the contract negotiations, it won’t get any better once you start formulating.
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@Leo:
All you need is Water, Betaine, Surfactant Blend, Preservatives
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The best thing to do is to simply ignore questions posted by someone who you do not feel has a geniune interest in formulating, but is just looking for a quick answer. Answering questions is completely at your discretion.
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Graillotion said:“those who have actually taken the time, and made the effort to test through these tedious combinations it is without equal.” I do NOT believe that all the synergies have been discovered, and that better things are yet to be created. I think creativity comes from smaller brands where we are not hamstrung with existing formulas, and sku’s that are on the shelf. Creativity comes from the sharing of ideas that can be implemented onto a clean sheet of paper….No industry bias allowed.
Creativity can come from anyone, anywhere, anytime … you just have to have the curiosity to actually experiment. The easiest thing is for someone to tell you “No” that won’t work, when they have not actually tried it and that is very common in life. It’s the people who are seeking that one “Yes” who make the breakthrough discoveries.
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Your regulatory responsibility to to create an accurate LOI which is a INCI listing of the ingredients in the formula ordered in accordance with the labelling requirements and ensure that the product is safe for consumer use. That does not include the Tradename or manufactuer of the ingredient.
What you divulge beyond that is a function of your contractual relationship with the client. If the client owns the intellectual property (ie: the formula) and has paid you for it, then your obligation would be the INCI, Tradename, Suppliers and Percentages. If you want to throw in SDS for each ingredient for good measure, then fine.
If your client has not negotiated with you the ownership of the IP to the formula (for which they should pay a premium), then you have no obligation to reveal the Tradeaname, Supplier & Percentages. You just develop the formula for them, test it, manufacture & fill and provide them with an LOI.
It sounds as though your work mate has yet to be burnt by full transparency with a client who has not paid full price for that level of detailed information. If your client has paid for full transparency, then you owe it to them, obviously.
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It all depends if you are using UltraPureGel primarily to stabilize the emulsion or to enhance viscosity? Of course, you can add a bit pre-emulsion and then another dollap post-emulsion if you want to achieve both effects.
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I don’t use DMDM, so I can’t advise you there. Given your list, I assume you’re making a Shampoo … you might try Phenoxyethanol + Caprylhydroxamic Acid … I don’t think that combination would reduce the viscosity of your shampoo.
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@Abdullah … well, if that’s the market environment in which you sell product, then you don’t have the issue of consumer/retailer channel resistance, so just use it at safe levels.
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The problem you’re going to have with DMDM is resistance from the consumer and distrubtion channels.
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Hello @Physicist_Formulator:
This is an interesting looking product. I am a skeptical of any claims of replacement of preservation systems as what that generally means is that the ingredients have anti-microbial properties, but are not registered as preservative ingredients, so the claim is generally specious.
Regardless, it is intriguing and worth taking a look at and playing around with. I suspect it may be more of a preservation booster than a preservative replacement.
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Geogard Ultra often exhibits a downward pH drift, which is probably why the Sodium Citrate is included in this combination.
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This looks fine