johnb
Forum Replies Created
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BTMS is a cationic material - not an emulsifying wax and will be incompatible with the main detergents in the bar.
Silicones act as efficient defoaming agents - do you really want this?
No need to add protein or panthenol - totally pointless.
As you are not adding any extra water and the liquid detergents will be already preserved there should be no need to add further preservative. The high osmotic pressure exerted by the detergent mix will prevent the growth of almost all micro-organisms
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Nothing to do with the question but, I was once asked to formulate a camel shampoo.
I thought first of all it was a joke but, the company I worked for at the time sold the shampoo in multi-tonne shipments to various Middle Eastern countries.
It was notable that the shampoo had to be highly perfumed with similar fragrances to those topping the European designer fragrance markets at the time.
This was before all of the current problems in the Middle East and I still wonder if the shampoo was really for use on camels.
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Caramel is not a defined material and is available in different grades made by different processes. You could ask a caramel manufacturer if they have a suitable cationic compatible grade (there is a caramel making process which involves ammonia - this may be cationic compatible).
A trick I used for caramel as a colour in cosmetic products, including a conditioner, was to disperse the caramel concentrate as the first component in the mixing process.
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The level of all materials is extremely high for a leave-in conditioner
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I retired from mainstream work before these things were invented but, I can say that I’ve seen them in use in numerous companies that I’ve visited since them.
I doubt these tests are as reliable as a full scale count but for general checking purposes they look to be approaching the ideal.
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As Bill says, probably the xanthan gum - 0.8% is a very high level for this material but 15% of undefined actives may be the real problem.
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Are these of any help to you:
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Does it cause stinging on intact skin or just on freshly shaved skin?
If the former then there is something fundamentally wrong with your formulation.
If the latter, take note of my previous recommendation and don’t apply to recently shaved skin.
Regarding alcohol, it only burns on recently shaved skin - see the previous sentence for my views on that. There is no other easily available cosmetically acceptable and compatible solvent that will improve evaporation rates.
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If this is for the dog shampoo detailed in your previous posting, you have ignored some of the relevant recommendations offered there why should we believe that anything given here will be heeded.
Your dog will not appreciate the presence of mica in the shampoo and it will give you enormous formulation problems. Little point also in adding “oat oil” or aloe vera.
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Most times I’ve seen this very rare effect it has been caused by microbial growth.
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You could try using sugar (sucrose) in place of sorbitol.
The quality of the stearic acid may count as well. Avoid lower quality stearins - those with high amounts of unsaturates (oleic acid etc).
Many commercial transparent soaps (eg Pears) use alcohol in their manufacture. Part of this is allowed to evaporate after processing.
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It is always very unwise to put private email addresses on forums.
Unscrupulous people use web bots to scour the Internet for addresses in order to send all sorts of unwanted/illegal/foul/embarrassing correspondence.
If you want to contact members, use the private message service. It is then up to the member whether they want their email address to be known to the enquirer.
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Jane, thanks for that.
Shows how easy it is to lose track with all of these EU regs!
Obviously, I am unable to help.
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Ever wondered why there are no commercial products that use magnesium salts as deodorant actives? The reason is that it doesn’t work to a sufficient extent that most users are satisfied.
- Min amount of Mg salt to be effective? Well, taking the above into consideration, who knows?
- Cosmetic products should not be applied to recently shaved skin.
- Alcohol will increase the evaporation rate.
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Is my brain failing me?
I don’t have a clue as to what PAO is, and Goooogle is unable to give me a reasoned explanation.
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All of these fancy bits and bobs should/must be added to the completed soap, not introduced during saponfication.
Adding materials other than those required for the saponifying reaction will introduce all sorts of unknown and potential undesirable side reactions.
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I don’t understand the question.
What is skin progression?
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If this is an “unorthodox pomade” there is even greater reason to give more details of the formula. From what you have revealed so far, the unorthodoxy eludes me.
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Didn’t Emily
Flemer flood the forum recently with her spam? -
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it really depends what’s important to you.The most important part is if the product does what it is supposed to do. You can do as many in vitro tests as you like but if you don’t get the performance in vivo you may as well give up.
By the way, I am aware that Phenoxyethanol and Ethylhexylglycerin is also commonly used. What I was doing is offering an answer to your question posed earlier and your reference to the Elta MD products:
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Now what are good options for gentle preservatives happy at pH 6-7?My reply being:
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check what your quoted Elta MD uses: Phenoxyethanol, Iodopropynyl ButylcarbamateOne final point, you claim to have had two PhD graduates helping you in this (one a chemist, one a dermatologist). Fine, but please don’t use them as ammunition against any replies you may get here. I have a PhD and I have spent most of my working life amongst PhD graduates. I can tell you that some of the biggest fools I could ever imagine have been amongst those people.
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Apart from the antiquity of the thread, I should have pointed out that the recent response from Zink has no relevance whatsoever to the the original enquiry.
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This thread dates back to June 2015.
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But isn’t the in vivo result the important aspect?
Regarding the preservative, check what your quoted Elta MD uses: Phenoxyethanol, Iodopropynyl Butylcarbamate
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More logical is not to add the excess of sodium chloride in the first place.
Adding more surfactant would not achieve the right end.
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Jane Barber, I think you have missed the point. The request is for hair cleansing with oil, not face cleansing.
Personally, I thing the current request is a non-starter. I would hate the feel of oil in my hair and to have that there permanently would sent me rushing to the shampoo bottle.
I have just checked the Shehvoo web site and found the product is not quite as natzam44 claims.