[GabyD]

Hi Loosy, it depends on whether you are starting a small brand on your own or a big brand with a whole team of people.  If you let us know that, we can help.

I started my brand with a $10 Target hand mixer and a $20 hotplate.

[GabyD]

czkld said:

@GabyD Can you tell me more about it?? Im really curious, I wanted to use that mix

Many people are sensitive to it. Including myself and my husband, who have never experienced sensitivity before and have two completely different skin types.

I spoke to Thor extensively about this and they suggested I bring the pH up to 6 or 5.8 at a maximum. That whole batch went mouldy!

I then discovered that Thor were WRONG and that Potassium Sorbate and Sodium Benzoate don’t work at such a high pH.

My advice would be to find another preservative.

[GabyD]

Why do you want to replace it? And do you want the new ingredient to be the active ingredient, or the preservative?

[GabyD]

I wonder if it works by preventing the lash from falling out? So it just continues to grow?

[GabyD]

Some preservatives do not work at such a high ph as 5.5.  

[GabyD]

How can I get a perfumer?  Thanks.

[GabyD]

shechemie said:

GabyD said:

I had this problem with AMTcide and Leudical. It passed PET, but then every single batch went mouldy.  Never again.

Sorry you had to deal with that! Out of curiosity,  do you know the criteria of the testing done and at what point it failed?  I’m surprised that your product initially passed PET.

I started to see bacterial colonies about 36 hours after streaking mine.  My product had been bottled for 30ish days for I streaked it. The agar I used was for bacteria growth.  Lord only knows what a fungal plate would look like ????.  

The phethyl alcohol cocktail is still clear ????????????????????

Hi there,

It passed the whole PET, which I think was 4 weeks. The original samples were made by our formulator and she sent them to the UK for testing.  

I then made the formulas myself following her instructions to the letter.  The creams looked good at first, but then about 2 weeks later were completely mouldy.  It was horrible.  

I wondered if my lab or equipment were not clean enough and bleached everything, but actually I don’t think it was that as the same thing happened again.  I just don’t think the preservatives were very good.

[GabyD]

I had this problem with AMTcide and Leudical. It passed PET, but then every single batch went mouldy.  Never again.

[GabyD]

I had a formula that I just could not get right. It worked perfectly well for the formulator I bought it from, alas it became unstable when I tried to make it myself. And this was multiple times over a 2 year period. I concluded that I’m just not good at creating things from scratch!

[GabyD]

Thanks Perry. Do you mean mix for 20 mins? I will also add more preservative proportional to the added ingredients. 

[GabyD]

I had exactly this problem! It turned out to be the Potassium Sorbate and Sodium Benzoate preservative I was using. The redness and stinging was quite severe.  We had to ditch the entire batch.  

[GabyD]

I have that exact machine and I use it to fill creams.  The only problem I have is that the cream comes out like a worm when filled cold.  So I heat it gently beforehand and give it a good stir and it comes out fine.  Leave the nozzle below the surface and pull it out at the last minute and you’ll get that nice swirl.

[GabyD]

@Pharma, would it help to fill the jars whilst the product is still a bit warm, then put them in the fridge for a while before putting the lids on?

[GabyD]

Great advice Mark, thank you.

[GabyD]

Thank @ngarayeva001, I shall look into both of those.

[GabyD]

@ngarayeva001What are you using instead of Siligel?

[GabyD]

What’s wrong with Siligel? 

[GabyD]

So my mouldy Day Cream sample is back from the preservative manufacturers.  They said it is contaminated with Penicillium spp.  They also said that, at pH 5.9, the pH is way above the level Microcare SB will be effective in preserving the product.

[GabyD]

@Masonia I look forward to reading your research. In the meantime, wouldn’t it be good if you could hire a homogeniser? I have looked but there does not seem to be a company that does this. Shame.

[GabyD]

… and regarding the IP. I gave her $2k as payment for manufacturing a small run of creams. However, she failed to deliver on this so we agreed to offset it against the IP.

[GabyD]

@MarkBroussard, I am aware of how it looks, but I am trying to salvage a deal so am going along with the manufacturers to try to resolve things. They are carrying out PET for free and we will then see whether or not the MSB works. If not, then it will be incumbent upon them to provide an alternative. 

We are very limited in that we can only use ingredients approved by Ecocert and we are also palm oil-free so that limits us even further.

[GabyD]

I just wish there were some good formulators and manufacturers in Australia who didn’t let you down.  Seriously, the last thing I want to be doing is formulating and making my own products but I have no choice.

[GabyD]

Another point about Carol is that I paid a hefty deposit for the IP.  I attempted to pay the balance but she refused to sign the IP Agreement.  She wanted to use her own IP Agreement, not the proper one drawn up by a solicitor.  Then last week I heard from a mutual acquaintance in the industry that she was hawking our formula around trying to sell the IP to the highest bidder.  

[GabyD]

@Microformulation, I would never expect a formulator to reformulate for free, and you are certainly not a “Carol”.  In our case, Carol made a sample for us and we were very happy with it.  The day we got it I emailed her and said it was amazing, thank you so much, please can we push forward, etc. She emailed me ONCE to say “I have only gone and made it better!” then we did not hear from her for months.  I kept emailing, calling, but nothing.  I only knew she was still alive because she was posting on Instagram.  This went on for 7 months.  

I mentioned this to one of her colleagues as I was afraid that I had done something to upset her.  He laughed and reassured me that she’s like that with everyone.  Really enthusiastic at the beginning then quickly loses interest.

I was also contacted by someone on here who recognised her pattern of behaviour because it had happened to them.  Another of “Carol’s” victims.

[GabyD]

Hi @Belassi, the manufacturers are insistent it should work and are providing full PET for free. 

But I’m listening… please tell me why it is not good and what alternatives there are that are Ecocert approved and Palm Oil-Free.  Thanks.