[belassi]

We expect to go into the second phase of our startup once our brand is registered, and one of those will be the first thing I buy, together with an overhead stirrer. I’ve decided to change our hot process shampoo back to cold process. It costs more in ingredients but I calculate that avoiding the need to heat, extra time, etc. it will be about the same and allow me to avoid investing in giant heated tanks. 

[belassi]

Thank you for the excellent post, Bob.

[belassi]

It is a substance that’s readily available so if you learn more it could be very interesting. There is already a ‘vegetable botox’ available but it costs a pretty penny.

[belassi]

I looked at most of what was available online and did not interpret it as “to relax muscles like botox”. If you’re in the USA then I agree with what Bob said. Secondly, a topical application is extremely unlikely to get below the derma and into the muscles. Don’t you think?

[belassi]

The panic system

[belassi]

Depends on your scale of production. I’m usually offering test product to our testers within weeks of receiving a new sample. Launching it as a commercial product is a different matter though.

[belassi]

Yes. I have been making cold process soap for about 5 years and with the solid soap process it’s easy to allow say 5% superfat allowance and then you’re certain that all the base is converted and the product is skin friendly. As I understand it, and my own experiments confirmed, if you try to superfat with KOH (liquid) soap, then you end up sequestering while the superfat layer settles out, and so on … or you use no superfat allowance (or excess KOH) and neutralise with borax. We still sell CP bar soap but much prefer synthetic liquid soap.

[belassi]

We have seen a big difference in results between a moisturiser without and the same with, pea polypeptides, but since we don’t market in the USA we have no problem with claims.

[belassi]

It is in Mexico City unfortunately otherwise I would have gone for a look around.

[belassi]

I both agree and disagree with what has been said. Nobody trained me to become a personal care chemist; yet my product line after 4 years development is, I believe, top class. On the other hand, I know my way around chemistry, I used to teach it at secondary school level. I do believe a sound knowledge of chemistry is essential. And talent.

[belassi]

I’ve been wondering about this. If you add citric acid to sodium cocoate to lower its pH you get a snotty mess. It simply doesn’t work. That is why boracic acid (borax) is used, as I understand, for liquid soap. I agree totally with BartJ.

[belassi]

Revisiting your original question:

If this product was 50% hydrosol and 50% oils, would I have to add a preservative in order to sell it?

How do you propose to make such an item without an emulsifier or solubilising agent? And secondly, could you be a bit more precise on “oils”?

[belassi]

Also Kpnangnan butter which is fabulous stuff but tough to obtain. Sometimes known as golden shea. Even higher in retinol and leaves a powdery skin effect.

[belassi]

http://www.cosmeticsdesign.com/Business-Financial/Unilever-buys-soap-brands-and-Mexico-facility-from-P-G 

Maybe this the reason behind the plant closing. Possibly the same plant produced soap and that line has also been sold, to Kimberly-Clark. Apparently 170 people worked at the plant.

[belassi]

FURTHER:

While researching phytic acid I came across THIS enormous patent application which has areas directly relevant but you will need to be a fast reader.

The same document describes MASCARA formulations and since this is reputed to be a very difficult area of cosmetic chemistry, may be of use to some here which is why I mention it.

[belassi]

The one thing nobody mentioned is: talent. You either have it or you don’t. Like chefs.

[belassi]

Not terribly expensive. At say 5% concentration the price equivalent is 1/20 or around $7 a kilo for that ingredient in finished product. So around $40 a kilo at retail. 

I think I would market this in a similar physical way to the way hair dye is marketed. First you do the nasty thing then you get a result then you repair the damage with the nice thing. So I think I’d have all the peel ingredients in the first, then after the peel you slather on moisturiser, sun barrier, lightener, anti-inflammatory, all that good stuff. The first is a 15-minute rinse off and the second is a leave-on cream. All in one box.

[belassi]

By the way, may I ask the price of the phytic acid? I might design a phytic peel further down the line.

[belassi]

First, I think the product in the images looks disgusting, very unsightly.

The LOI is pretty unsightly too. Especially the “paraffinum liquidum” part. The peel is caused by the actives, especially the phytic acid. I should list the actives, decide the relevant percentages to use, then consider what else needs to be done to make an attractive product.

Secondly, I think the idea of combining a peel with a lightening action is pretty stupid. You’re going to put the lightening actives into the top layer of the skin … and then 15 minutes later you remove it all again, and then peel off the top layer of skin? Just a waste of actives.

This should be a two-stage treatment. First, the peel. Then once the peel has completed, stage two is lightening actives plus skin protection.

[belassi]

Internal J&J memo produced in court:

In the trial, Fox’s attorneys introduced into evidence a September 1997 internal memo from a Johnson & Johnson medical consultant suggesting that “anybody who denies [the] risks” between “hygenic” talc use and ovarian cancer would be publicly perceived in the same light as those who denied a link between smoking cigarettes and cancer: “Denying the obvious in the face of all evidence to the contrary.”

IMO J&J have done a massively serious disservice to the industry.

[belassi]

Better Call Saul . . . 

[belassi]

Unless you are in some place like Saudi Arabia I wouldn’t worry about it.

[belassi]

I don’t use talc in our products or sell it because I cannot be certain it is pure enough. Historically the risk from talc was because it could contain small amounts of asbestos. However this case links the use of talc to ovarian cancer directly and according to the article in the newspaper the jury appears to have been swayed by internal memos of Johnson & Johnson. 

[belassi]

Shea butter is great for the hair and since you already found it gives good results I’d stick with that.

[belassi]

Denatured alcohol refers to ethanol that has had a small amount of bitter substance added. 0.7% is about one-sixth the strength of beer. You could use any commercial source of cheap ethanol as long as it is reasonably pure (no methanol etc)