Home Cosmetic Science Talk Formulating Advanced Questions What Ingredient would you change and why?

  • What Ingredient would you change and why?

    Posted by ahealy on November 8, 2020 at 2:09 pm

    An interesting exercise I would like expert help with. If you could change one ingredient in this facial cleanser formulation, which would it be and why? 

    Water (Aqua), Sodium Laureth Sulfate, Sodium PEG-7 Olive Oil Carboxylate, Olive Oil PEG 7 Esters, Coco-Betaine, Potassium Lactate, PEG-120 Methyl Glucose Dioleate, Sodium Citrate, Lavandula Angustifolia (Lavender) Oil, Lactic Acid, Glycerin, Simmondsia Chinensis (Jojoba) Seed Oil, Ribes Nigrum (Blackcurrant) Seed Oil, Ormenis Multicaulis Oil, Benzyl Alcohol, Phenoxyethanol, Chamomilla Recutita (Matricaria) Flower Oil, Glycyrrhiza Glabra (Licorice) Root Extract, Magnesium Nitrate, Potassium Sorbate, Carum Petroselinum (Parsley) Seed Oil, Sodium Benzoate, Methylchloroisothiazolinone, Magnesium Chloride, Methylisothiazolinone, Linalool, d-Limonene.

    OldPerry replied 3 years, 6 months ago 4 Members · 11 Replies
  • 11 Replies
  • Pharma

    Member
    November 8, 2020 at 4:50 pm
    I’d take the ingredient ‘facial cleanser’ as fall guy and go with something without SLES, PEGs, and isothiazolinones :smiley: .
    Reasons for this can be found in several of my other posts.
  • ahealy

    Member
    November 8, 2020 at 6:56 pm

    Thank you for your reply. I chose MIT/MCIT due to the irritation potential but I imagine this wouldn’t be an issue in a rinse off product and at such low levels. I also struggled to think of an alternative and came to the conclusion that ethylhexylglycerin and phenoxyethanol could be a good substitute?  
    I initially thought SLES but there isn’t much data to support this being a harmful ingredient from what I have read so far (happy to be corrected here - novice)
    I’ll have a look through your posts. 

  • Pharma

    Member
    November 8, 2020 at 8:33 pm

    Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying those ingredients aren’t safe. I just don’t like them (true, MIT/MCIT I really don’t like and avoid if possible, they’re already in so much stuff which one can’t avoid…) although SLES and PEG-derivatives are very efficient and so far safe. SLES can be a bit stripping but there are many workarounds for that issue if you consider it an issue.

  • belassi

    Member
    November 8, 2020 at 11:52 pm

    Thiazolinones are an absolute no-no as far as i am concerned. I have direct bad experiences with them. My wife had AD on her hands using a dishwash detergent containing it. My daughter’s hair began falling out due to the same preservative in Sedal hair conditioner. Both my dogs had serious AD due to being shampooed by a vet’s shampoo using that preservative. And so on. Should be banned. I am in fact running a public safety campaign on Facebook against products that use it.

  • ahealy

    Member
    November 9, 2020 at 9:04 am

    Pharma, please can I enquire as to why you don’t like them? Again, no right or wrong answer, I’d just appreciate your thoughts. Thank you. 

  • OldPerry

    Member
    November 9, 2020 at 2:43 pm

    It’s a cleanser.  Why are you including oils?  They simply make the cleanser part of your product less effective.  In fact, none of the following ingredients need to be in the formula.

    Lavandula Angustifolia (Lavender) Oil,
    Simmondsia Chinensis (Jojoba) Seed Oil,
    Ribes Nigrum (Blackcurrant) Seed Oil,
    Ormenis Multicaulis Oil,
    Chamomilla Recutita (Matricaria) Flower Oil,
    Carum Petroselinum (Parsley) Seed Oil
    Glycerin
    Glycyrrhiza Glabra (Licorice) Root Extract

  • ahealy

    Member
    November 10, 2020 at 2:54 pm

    They would make the cleanser part of the formulation less effective how? 
    The additional ingredients are for skin benefits and claims, do you not think they add anything to the overall formulation?

  • OldPerry

    Member
    November 10, 2020 at 5:28 pm

    Cleanser work by removing oil.  The Sodium Laureth Sulfate (SLES) in your formula seeks out oil, surrounds it, and then removes it when rinsed away. The SLES does not care whether the oil comes from your face or from the other things in your formula. So, when you include oils to a cleansing formula you essentially tie up your surfactant with that oil and it isn’t available to clean the oil off your face.  Thus your cleanser no longer cleans as well as it should.

    No, I do not think those additional ingredient provide any benefit. Cleansers are meant to remove things from the surface. Glycerin is water soluble so that will rinse away (it also reduces foam).  The licorice root extract is also water soluble and rinses away.  And the oils, they will all get emulsified by the SLES and rinsed away.

    If you add them for claims reasons, that makes sense. Just know that they are actually not providing any benefit beyond claims.

  • ahealy

    Member
    November 11, 2020 at 4:47 pm

    Thank you so much for your feedback and thoughts, I am still a novice and value it greatly. Can I ask, or could you point me in the direction of an “ideal” cleanser. Would you say primary and secondary surfactant, humectants, preservatives and thickeners are all that you’d need? 

  • belassi

    Member
    November 11, 2020 at 5:08 pm

    could you point me in the direction of an “ideal” cleanser.
    Sure. Try what I use: Stepan APB (All-Purpose-Blend). It’s excellent.

  • OldPerry

    Member
    November 11, 2020 at 9:40 pm

    @ahealy - this may sound like dodging your question but the truth is that without knowing more information there is no “ideal” cleanser to suggest.

    It depends on a number of factors including…

    1.  Your product performance goals
    2.  Your marketing position / story
    3.  Your cost target
    4.  The aesthetics that you (or your customer) believe are best
    5.  Your manufacturing capabilities
    6.  The raw materials you have access to

    In my mind a blend of water, SLES, Cocamidopropyl betaine, & salt will give you the best functional performance. Of course you’ll need preservative, fragrance and color to make it a more appealing product but that is pretty much it. 

Log in to reply.