Home Cosmetic Science Talk Formulating Snow Mushroom Extract Substitute?

  • Snow Mushroom Extract Substitute?

    Posted by Anca_Formulator on February 7, 2022 at 6:51 pm

    Hi,
    I am making a light summer facial moisturizer with a ”jiggly’ texture using Siligel and Heliosoft (INCI: Behenyl Alcohol (and) Glyceryl Behenate (and) Lecithin) as emulsifiers.

    One of the humectants I use is Vegeluron (Tremella Fuciformis (Mushroom) Extract solution) at 2%. It’s a viscous gel based on a mushroom polysaccharide, very similar to NatraSmooth.  It’s supposed to be a superior alternative to hyaluronic acid. 

    I love it but…I need to replace it in my formula because it is $400/kg! What can I replace it with that has both superior moisturizing properties, and also that mucillage-siliconey texture, and is more cost-effective?

    I made 40 versions of this formula to get this texture and I don’t want to make 40 more to get back to the same texture…

    Any suggestions? Thank you!

    Linc replied 2 years, 2 months ago 11 Members · 18 Replies
  • 18 Replies
  • Pattsi

    Member
    February 8, 2022 at 7:20 am

    Change supplier, $400 is way over priced.

  • Microformulation

    Member
    February 8, 2022 at 3:00 pm

    Not to be negative, but get used to it. We are seeing raw materials go up a great deal since the supply issues and they will likely continue. One Formulator has seen 3-4 times increases in some materials.

  • Anca_Formulator

    Member
    February 8, 2022 at 6:08 pm

    @Microformulation I wish this were an increase due to supply chain, we are facing those everywhere in our  business. This is just an expensive ingredient period so that’s why I was trying to find an alternative. 

  • helenhelen

    Member
    February 8, 2022 at 8:11 pm

    It is much cheaper than $400/kg on Skinchakra.. I think they ship to the US… although not sure how much the shipping is.

    These sound like they could be alternative natural mucilage gels:
    https://www.formulatorsampleshop.com/phytofuse-rejuvenate.html
    https://www.formulatorsampleshop.com/phytofuse-renew.html

    Vegeluron sounds interesting. How does the slip and feel of it compare to Siligel? Is it sticky at all?

     

  • GeorgeBenson

    Member
    February 8, 2022 at 8:58 pm

    I was recently quoted $2,500/kg from two different suppliers!

  • OldPerry

    Member
    February 8, 2022 at 10:02 pm

    Just use glycerin & maybe a cellulose

  • Graillotion

    Member
    February 8, 2022 at 10:32 pm

    I’m with Perry…just look at adding sodium PCA, or sodium lactate or glycerin, or propanediol…and a compatible gelling agent.  I get good mileage out of betaine…and a soother to boot.

    Of course, you have the option of adding it at .001%…whooping and hollering it on the label….and doing the dirty work with a functional. :) 

    Aloha.

  • jemolian

    Member
    February 9, 2022 at 12:37 am

    If you have to use Tremella, then perhaps source it as the original powder form. Some manufacturers do have them in a lower and higher molecular weight. Not sure if it would be cheaper that way but at least you can save on shipping fees due to weight of the premade solution. 

  • ngarayeva001

    Member
    February 9, 2022 at 8:10 pm

    I often guilty of buying into marketing but in this case I am 100% with Perry. Glycerin and xanthan would do the same. Maybe try different grades and select one that is more similar to tremella.

  • Linc

    Member
    February 10, 2022 at 1:40 am

    I love tremella. I’ve found the powder extract dissolves quite well into propanediol. 

  • Linc

    Member
    February 10, 2022 at 8:33 am

    there’s also this product, which is tremella in propanediol and just $16.24 USD per pound: https://www.newdirectionsaromatics.com/products/botanical-extracts/tremella-liquid-extract-100-natural-standardized.html

    I don’t know what it’s like but I just ordered a sample to compare it to my own powder + propanediol mix. 

    Any particular reasons you don’t want to use NatraSmooth? 

  • grapefruit22

    Member
    February 10, 2022 at 1:40 pm

    @helenhelen found out that there is a lower price on skinchakra. Sometimes for larger quantities the price is much lower (e.g. 40 USD/1 kg for 10 kg, 25 USD/1 kg for 20 kg), maybe they would have a better price for a larger quantity? As for Phytofuse range, I would say Phytofuse Rejuvenate is close to Vegeluron (Phytofuse Renew is more watery), but it is still not so good as original product in my opinion.
    Anyway, I would try with Sorbitol, or Carrageenan. 2% Vegeluron doesn’t have a big impact on viscosity, so I would focus on the silicone/mucilage slipping.

  • Anca_Formulator

    Member
    February 12, 2022 at 12:20 am

    Thanks everyone. Some really great suggestions!

  • Anca_Formulator

    Member
    February 12, 2022 at 12:22 am

    @Linc NatraSmoth is $408/kg for the low amount I need (at LotionCrafter) and it’s also in glycerin not Propanediol.                   I think Propanediol is more moisturizing than glycerin. I will definitely check out the Tremella from New Directions. Thank you!

  • Linc

    Member
    February 13, 2022 at 4:12 am

    @Linc NatraSmoth is $408/kg for the low amount I need (at LotionCrafter) and it’s also in glycerin not Propanediol.                   I think Propanediol is more moisturizing than glycerin. I will definitely check out the Tremella from New Directions. Thank you!

    Nice! Yeah the NatraSmooth didn’t really appeal to me for that reason as well. I will try to update this thread once I receive the ND tremella in a few weeks. I’d be interested to hear what you think of it, if you try it.

  • Anca_Formulator

    Member
    February 18, 2022 at 7:45 pm

    @helenhelen
    Vegeluron is not sticky at all on the skin.  In my opinion it’s more slippy and ‘wet’ and compared to Siligel.

  • Anca_Formulator

    Member
    February 18, 2022 at 7:49 pm

    @Linc
    Where did you get your Tremella powder? Thanks. 

  • Linc

    Member
    April 6, 2022 at 9:41 pm

    @Linc
    Where did you get your Tremella powder? Thanks. 

    So sorry for the delay, I missed this question. The tremella powder came from nootropicsdepot. They wholesale it (link at the bottom of their site) but it’s a 25kg MOQ. However their quality is second to none. 

    I’ve been happy with New Directions tremella though, it’s been so much easier to work with and has imparted the desired effect in my testing. 

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