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Home Cosmetic Science Talk Formulating How to use Natrosol/HEC as thickener?

  • How to use Natrosol/HEC as thickener?

    Posted by Nahlllailatul on January 6, 2023 at 1:53 am

    Hi everyone, I’ve been working on dishwashing formula recently
    I use HEC as thickener, I’ve tried two methods in dissolving HEC.

    The first method I used is to dissolve HEC in water first and stir it until it reach the desired viscosity and then mix it with another composition.
    The second method I used is dissolving HEC powder into my formula solution (exclude HEC).

    from this two methods, both of them cannot dissolve the HEC well, so the mixture is parted into two phases. The HEC is placed on the bottom, and the another solution is placed on top of it. 
    Can you give me some advice about this matter please? or please kindly give your recommendation to try another thickener or another formula.
    Thank you so much

    ketchito replied 4 months, 1 week ago 3 Members · 6 Replies
  • 6 Replies
  • ketchito

    Member
    January 6, 2023 at 2:38 am

    @Nahlllailatul In the first method, after about 10-15 min, you could add some base (sodium hydroxide for instance), to help speed up the hydration process, and to ensure it was done completely. 

  • Nahlllailatul

    Member
    January 6, 2023 at 3:06 pm
    @ketchito Thank you for your advice. What if the soap solution condition is already alkaline? because my soap solution is alkaline, and at 10 or 15 minutes after dissolving HEC, the solution start to have some thickness and homogenous. But after leave it for several hours the solution start to parted into two phases. 
  • chemicalmatt

    Member
    January 6, 2023 at 9:24 pm

    @Nahlllailatul, yours is one of those cases where without knowing the other ingredients present in your formula, we cannot be of much assistance. I will add that HEC is not a good first choice for thickening “soap” formulations. Hydroxypropyl methylcellulose is preferred. Look into the Methocel line from DuPont-Dow.

  • Nahlllailatul

    Member
    January 8, 2023 at 7:23 am

    @chemicalmatt Okay, thank you so much, I will give it a try

  • Nahlllailatul

    Member
    January 17, 2023 at 3:07 am

    @chemicalmatt Hi, see you again. I’ve tried using HPMC for floor mop soap.
    Here is my formula : 
    1. Sodium metasilicate pentahydrate 5%
    2. CDEA 6%
    3. STPP 5%
    4. NaOH 1.5%
    5. Phenoxyethanol 0,5%
    6. Fragrance 2%
    7. Propylene Glycol 2%
    8. Dipropylene Glycol 2%
    9. HPMC 0,5%
    10. Demineralized water 94%

    I use 50% of the total demineralized water to thicken my HPMC
    and dissolve the other ingredients using the rest of demineralized water, after that I mix the HPMC solution with my soap solution, and I got homogenous and thick soap. 
    But after leaver it for several hours, my soap solution start to parted into two phase
    What should I do to dissolve HPMC correctly? Are there something wrong with my formula? Feel free to correct and criticize me if I make mistake. I want to learn from you guys :)

  • ketchito

    Member
    January 17, 2023 at 10:45 am

    @Nahlllailatul Yours is a very tricky formula. You have high levels of electrolytes, very high pH and solvents. You need very specific polymers to thicken thag mixture. Another aproach would be not to use polymers, but surfactants. If you don’t mind having a bit of foam, you could replace some of your CDEA by Cocamidopropyl betaine. The combination gives a nice viscosity, but you need to find the right ratio.