Home Cosmetic Science Talk Formulating General Off Topic GMS or GSC for partner with Sucrose Stearate in a cream?

  • GMS or GSC for partner with Sucrose Stearate in a cream?

    Posted by graillotion on October 6, 2022 at 8:09 pm

    Looking to make a thick cream (emulsified body butter), and trying to find a good haptic starting point to build from.

    My research has shown both GMS and GSC (Glyceryl stearate citrate) as common dance partners for Sucrose Stearate.

    Does anyone have enough experience with these combos….to suggest what the difference in ‘feel’ would be with these two optional starting points?

    Granted I will build most of the haptics with other ingredients….but why not start with something awesome?

    Aloha.

    suswang8 replied 1 year, 5 months ago 5 Members · 8 Replies
  • 8 Replies
  • graillotion

    Member
    October 6, 2022 at 9:04 pm

    I also keep glycerol oleate on hand…. considering this is a body butter….and SS is high HLB…and GO is low, with a strong refatting feel.  Am I thinking in the right direction?

  • chemicalmatt

    Member
    October 7, 2022 at 8:08 pm

    Hi @Graillotion, do you mean self-emulsifying GMS? I’ll assume so. My experience GSC is a superior emulsifier even to sucrose stearate. As dance partners go, it may be surprising to know which one leads.

  • graillotion

    Member
    October 7, 2022 at 9:47 pm

    Hi @Graillotion, do you mean self-emulsifying GMS? I’ll assume so. My experience GSC is a superior emulsifier even to sucrose stearate. As dance partners go, it may be surprising to know which one leads.

    NOT  a fan of GMS/SE…. all though I see Making Cosmetics goes that route.  I was referring to just straight up GMS.  I am not opposed to using 165 either…as I use more of that than any other emulsifier.  But if I can do the job w/o a PEG….hey more power to it.

    The only reason I was thinking GMS over GSC was the spread in the HLB (which I don’t really use).  :)🙂

    I should preface…the formula will have some gum, some polymeric, and some behenyl alcohol, the usual builders.

  • graillotion

    Member
    October 8, 2022 at 5:37 am

     As dance partners go, it may be surprising to know which one leads.

    I am trying to extract some potential haptics out of the Sucrose stearate/palmitate.  However, I don’t think it is good enough by itself, so trying to prop it up with things that will give stability, while adding vs detracting from haptics.

  • abdullah

    Member
    October 8, 2022 at 11:09 am

    If you need to use 2 emulsifiers, i suggest GMS+ GSC or GMS+ Sucrose Stearate.

  • pharma

    Member
    October 8, 2022 at 6:01 pm
    Will your butter be an emulsion (o/w or w/o) or be anhydrous?
    To make o/w emulsions feel like a butter, you have to use lamellar structure builders, in the range of 10-20% I guess, when using sucrose monoesters as main emulsifier. GMS, fatty alcohols, and/or esters such as cetyl palmitate would be my starting point. Also, waxes and hydrogenated oils can be helpful.
    For w/o GMS or any other low HLB (high HLD) co-emulsifier such as Span’s (sorbitan esters) or low N° polyglyceryl (poly-)esters.
    In anhydrous formulations, I can’t see any real benefit in sucrose monoesters.
    Download (and read) Sisterna Formulation Guide 2020. However, their sample body butter requires sucrose distearate, too.
    Honestly, I wouldn’t use sucrose monoesters for that project!
  • graillotion

    Member
    October 8, 2022 at 8:55 pm

    Pharma said:

    Will your butter be an emulsion (o/w or w/o) or be anhydrous?
    To make o/w emulsions feel like a butter, you have to use lamellar structure builders, in the range of 10-20% I guess, when using sucrose monoesters as main emulsifier. GMS, fatty alcohols, and/or esters such as cetyl palmitate would be my starting point. Also, waxes and hydrogenated oils can be helpful.
    For w/o GMS or any other low HLB (high HLD) co-emulsifier such as Span’s (sorbitan esters) or low N° polyglyceryl (poly-)esters.
    In anhydrous formulations, I can’t see any real benefit in sucrose monoesters.
    Download (and read) Sisterna Formulation Guide 2020. However, their sample body butter requires sucrose distearate, too.
    Honestly, I wouldn’t use sucrose monoesters for that project!

    Thank you…. Yes, an emulsified o/w body butter… you know I could handle the ‘grease’ of an anhydrous one. :)   Yes…it will have the squalane wax and Cetyl palmitate….plus friends.

    You might like this one…lots of Mac nut oil (well…lots for my formulas).

  • suswang8

    Member
    October 17, 2022 at 3:19 am

    @Pharma:  Thank you for posting that guide from Sisterna

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