Home Cosmetic Science Talk Formulating Dishwashing liquid always turns cloudy

  • Dishwashing liquid always turns cloudy

    Posted by MakaMelo on September 16, 2019 at 8:32 am

    My dishwashing liquid always turns cloudy after a 24hrs. Here is my formulation:

    Caustic soda lye       0.8%
    Sulphonic acid SSR  8.5%
    Sles                              15%
    TEA                             0.4%
    CDE                                 1%
    Urea                                2%
    Formalin                     0.2%
    NP9                             0.6%
    Salt                             0.2%
    Fragrance                  0.3%
    Dye                              q.s
    Water                         71%

    I mix the salt seperately before adding to the mixture. I do the same for the urea
    pH is 6-8

    I’ve tried not adding any salt but I would still get the same result.

    Distilled water and normal tap water gives the same result.

    Wat could be the problem?

    Kindly assist.

    mahmoudfatthy replied 4 years, 8 months ago 7 Members · 11 Replies
  • 11 Replies
  • Pharma

    Member
    September 16, 2019 at 7:06 pm
    What stands SSR in sulfonic acid for? If it’s just sulfonic acid, then there would be no point in neutralising it.
    Urea will do nothing apart from degrading (especially at a pH as high as 8).
    NP9 is prohibited in EU and highly disadviced by the US EPA.
    What is CDE?
  • smok

    Member
    September 16, 2019 at 7:48 pm

    what is your material using to mix
    you add first sulphonic and you neutralise

  • Fekher

    Member
    September 16, 2019 at 8:39 pm

    @MakaMelo decreasing the level of LABSA will solve the problem , you shoul work on the adequat level.

  • Gunther

    Member
    September 17, 2019 at 7:11 pm

    Probably there’s too much SLES, and maybe too little sulfonic acid too

    You just don’t add salt like that. You’d need to conduct a salt-curve experiment to determine the proper amount and conduct some cold temperature tests (fridge without freezing) to check for cloudiness.

    You can also conduct an “SLES-curve” experiment to determine the proper SLES amount.
    An SLES-only formulation will not cloud, but won’t cut grease as one containing sulfonate does
    but increased sulfonate rises cloud point.

    Get rid of urea, and replace formalin with another preservative.

  • MakaMelo

    Member
    September 19, 2019 at 9:05 pm

    @Pharma CDE is Cocodiethanolamide

  • MakaMelo

    Member
    September 19, 2019 at 9:07 pm

    @smok i am using a plastic drum to mix.

  • MakaMelo

    Member
    September 19, 2019 at 9:09 pm

    @Fekher I will try and decrease the amount of LABSA and see what dìfference it makes. Thank you.

  • MakaMelo

    Member
    September 19, 2019 at 9:13 pm

    @Gunther what other preservative could I use apart from formalin?

  • MakaMelo

    Member
    September 19, 2019 at 9:14 pm

    Do I replace NP9 with something else or just remove it altogether?

  • DAS

    Member
    September 20, 2019 at 8:00 pm

    If I had to make a bet my money would be on a combo of cheap quality materials. Although I suspect the main issue is the CDEA. Surely soy, sunflower, palm or anything but cocoamide. Those damn long chains are only holding together because Urea is working as an hydrotrope and prevents a complete phase separation, but I don’t think it would hold a week in the oven. But to know for sure I recommend you do a knockout, start with the basics and add the rest of your ingredients one by one. 

    If you want to replace NP9 you could use an ethoxylated fatty alcohol, although you don’t actually need it. As for preservatives you should ask your suppliers what they can offer, most common is a MIT/CMIT combo. 

  • mahmoudfatthy

    Member
    September 22, 2019 at 8:38 pm
    Caustic soda lye       0.8%
    Sulphonic acid SSR  8.5%
    Sles                              15%
    TEA                             0.4%
    Hydroxyethyl Cellulose 2.5                              
    Urea                                2%
    Formalin                     0.2%                            
    Salt                             0.2%
    Fragrance                  0.3%
    Dye                              q.s
    Water                         71%
    ph 7 

Log in to reply.