• Formulating

  Counter-ions for Carrageenan

  Posted by hatasamatter on December 6, 2023 at 10:16 am

  Hi! I have a “noob” question about Carrageenan. In my starting formula I have Xanthan Gum as a thickener which I’d like to replace with Carrageenan. I know that for Carrageenan, you’re supposed to include a counter-ion for it to form a gel, depending on which type of Carrageenan you’re using. For Kappa and Iota Carrageenan, potassium and sodium ions - please correct me if I’m wrong.

  My question is which ingredients I should use as counter ions. Would Sodium Chloride work? Also, at what percentage? Would 0.5% Sodium Chloride in my formula work?

  Thank you so much in advance, your advice is greatly appreciated!

  This is my starting formula:

  Phase A:

  Water Aqua — ad 100%

  Phase A1:

  Glycerin — 3.00%

  Xanthan Gum (Carrageenan) — 0.50%

  Phase B:

  Glyceryl Stearate Citrate — 3.00%

  Cetearyl Alcohol — 2.50%

  Almond Oil Prunus Amygdalus Dulcis Oil — 20.90%

  Mimosa Acacia Decurrens Flower Cera — 2.00%

  Tocopherol, Helianthus Annuus (Sunflower) Seed Oil — 0.10%

  Phase C:

  Preservative — q.s.

  Instructions:

  Add phase A1 to A at 55 °C and mix until completely dissolved. Heat phase A/A1 and B separately to 75–80 °C. Add phase B to A/A1 under stirring. Homogenize for 90 seconds. Cool under moderate stirring. Add phase C below 40 °C. Cool further to RT and fill into suitable packaging.

  hatasamatter replied 3 months, 2 weeks ago 3 Members · 6 Replies

  • carrageenan
  • counter-ion
  • emulsion
  • ions
  • sodium-chloride-2
• 6 Replies

• 

  ketchito

  Member

  December 7, 2023 at 9:43 am

  I believe it’s divalent ions the ones that help carrageenan molecules to bridge between each other, so better use Calcium chloride.

  • 

    hatasamatter

    Member

    December 7, 2023 at 9:59 am

    Thank you so much for your reply! When do you recommending adding the calcium chloride? Directly into my carrageenan/glycerin premix?

• 

  evchem2

  Member

  December 7, 2023 at 12:53 pm

  
  @ketchito is right on, especially for iota carrageenan- divalents will work best and you can usually use a bit less than the monovalents which will help reduce chance of instability (maybe try 0.1-0.2% CaCl2 or MgSO4?). Since you’re making an o/w system, I would suggest adding those salts after forming the emulsion (https://www.ulprospector.com/knowledge/11641/pcc-tips-and-tricks-guaranteed-to-improve-the-your-formulations-part-one/) .

  Do you know which type of carrageenan you are using?

  

  ulprospector.com

  Tips and Tricks Guaranteed to Improve Your Formulations (Part One)

  Water Based Thickeners The easiest way to add xanthan gum to the water phase of your formulations is to first disperse the gum into a water-miscible solven

  • 

    hatasamatter

    Member

    December 7, 2023 at 6:57 pm

    Thank you so much for your help! Lots of valuable knowledge for me in that article. I don’t know which type of carrageenan I have available exactly but I will report back once I do! Thank you again!

• 

  hatasamatter

  Member

  January 12, 2024 at 12:00 pm

  Soo the carrageenan I’ll most likely be using is an iota type! <b style=”font-family: inherit; font-size: inherit; -webkit-text-size-adjust: 100%;”>Gelcarin® PC 379

• 

  hatasamatter

  Member

  January 17, 2024 at 10:23 am

  Hi, I was wondering if - even though I have an iota type carrageenan - I could also use sodium/potassium, maybe at a higher concentration than the divalent? And would adding a preservative with sodium/potassium suffice? I’m asking because I have I have a preservative called Euxyl K 712 (INCI: Sodium Benzoate (and) Potassium Sorbate (and) Aqua) already available and was wondering if this could already be enough in my formula (recommended concentration for this preservative is 0.5-1.5%). Thank you so much!

  • This reply was modified 3 months, 2 weeks ago by  hatasamatter.

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