Home Cosmetic Science Talk Formulating COMBINING POLYQUATERNIUM 7 AND CARBOPOL 350


    Posted by niecie2k on April 9, 2022 at 12:15 pm

    I am trying to make a hair gel with carbopol.  When I add the polyquat, I get “goop”.  Hopefully you all know what that means.  I do understand why this is happening.  It’s obviously the opposing charges.  My question is, is there a way to overcome this?  I am adding 2% polyquat to a 60 gram batch.  Here is the formula.  I am adding drops of tea after the first 5 ingredients to neutralize.

    47.4 79%
    3 5% propanediol
    0.3 0.50% carbomer
    0 tea
    1.2 2% PVP
    1.2 2% Poly 7
    1.8 3.00% broc sd oil
    3 5.00%
    0.3 0.50% panthenol
    0.24 0% quinoa protein
    1.2 2.00%
    rice curl complex
    0.3 1% preservative
    0.06 0.10% vit E
    niecie2k replied 1 year, 10 months ago 4 Members · 6 Replies
  • 6 Replies
  • ketchito

    April 11, 2022 at 3:48 am

    @niecie2k Did you try your formula without the Poly 7? I believe that for a hair gel, you don’t need to include it. 

    It’d be very hard to work with both carbomer and Poly 7 in current formula. Usually, shampoos can include both ingredients, since anionic surfactants help reduce Poly 7’s charge density by forming a complex, but there’s nothing in your formula that can do the same. But again, I believe you’re ok without using it.

  • Camel

    April 11, 2022 at 4:43 am

    I agree with @ketchito; I don’t think you need PQ-7 in this formula, but if you really want to include it, try using a smaller amount. Garnier uses PQ-11 in their “curl scrunch” gel with carbomer, but judging by its placement on the LOI, it’s less than 1%. 

    Also, what is the reason for adding oil to a water-based hair gel?

  • niecie2k

    April 11, 2022 at 8:18 am

    Two terrific answers.  Thank you!!!  So - my reason for adding oil is that it helps keep frizz away, smoothing and moisturizing my fine, frizzy hair.  The reason I wanted to add Polyquat 7 is to balance out the charges in my hair.  I did subsequently reduce the polyquat to 1% from 2% and I got a lot less of the “gunk”.  Thank you both again, for taking the time to answer.  🙂

  • Camel

    April 11, 2022 at 8:35 am

    @niecie2k, just be mindful of the stability of your gel as the oils may separate over time without an emulsifier. The carbomer may keep it suspended and looking stable, but it could possibly separate. You may be interested in looking into formulating gel-creams for your hair! 

  • Abdullah

    April 11, 2022 at 1:52 pm

    Why dont you use HEC or HPMC instead of carbomer? 

    I would say use 0.01% active pq7.

  • niecie2k

    June 13, 2022 at 8:17 am

    Thank you.  I will try it with HEC although I haven’t had much luck with it in the past with hair gels.  It has always separated on me.

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