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Can cold weather change transparency of liquid detergent?
I have made liquid detergent using polymer NA -CMC and ph was at around 10. For 2 /3 month it was blue and transperant like just as Arial liquid but now in my country winter started and liquid showing cloudiness. Not blue and transperant as was before. Polymer settled at bottom but dispersed soon after shake. Please tell the reason and solution too.any ingredient that prevent it?
@ketchito
@Abdullah -
19 Replies
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PEG-based surfactants/detergents are temperature sensitive. The solution would be to either not let your product get cold or change the detergent.You can also play with additives such as alcohol and change the amount of salt (if you have any).Maybe check out some manufacturer’s brochures or the like. -
What is your formula?
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And how cold does it get?
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Pharma said:PEG-based surfactants/detergents are temperature sensitive. The solution would be to either not let your product get cold or change the detergent.You can also play with additives such as alcohol and change the amount of salt (if you have any).Maybe check out some manufacturer’s brochures or the like.
@Pharma I did not use salt but used
NA-CMC polymer for viscosity and soil release purpose. As you indiacted, should I use polythelene glycol PEG surfactant in place of it or a combination of both? Please reply. -
@drjayseesunish You might want to answer the questions @Abdullah posed, they’re mandatory to give further advice.
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@drjayseesunish Did you do a knockout test (with and without the ingredient) to make sure it is the polymer settling down? As @Pharma mentioned, your surfactant system might be sensitive to cold environment, and that’s what you see first as cloudiness and then as a preciputate at the bottom. For instance, if you have a sulfonate, that one tends to produce cloudiness and precipitate in some systems, especially in the presence of salt (you don’t need to add it yourself, ingredients such as CAPB carry high levels of salt). I’d be better if you mention what else is in your formula.
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checked for microbial contamination?.
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ketchito said:@drjayseesunish Did you do a knockout test (with and without the ingredient) to make sure it is the polymer settling down? As @Pharma mentioned, your surfactant system might be sensitive to cold environment, and that’s what you see first as cloudiness and then as a preciputate at the bottom. For instance, if you have a sulfonate, that one tends to produce cloudiness and precipitate in some systems, especially in the presence of salt (you don’t need to add it yourself, ingredients such as CAPB carry high levels of salt). I’d be better if you mention what else is in your formula.
@ketchito please have a look upon formula
Water
NAOH..2.4%
LABSA -14%
SLES- 8%
AOS-4%
CDEA-2%
CAPB-4%
EDTA disodium-0.5%
CBSX-0.4%
Laurel alcohol ethoxylate -8%
PVP K -30 -0.25%
Sodium salt of CMC-1%
Fragrance
Colour
PH 10I didn’t require salt for viscosity.
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Don’t see a preservative
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@drjayseesunish That’s a high amount of LABSA. I never got further than 8% without switching neutralizers (from NaOH to TEA) or adding a hydrotrope (like SXS). You could either reduce the amount of LABSA, switch to TEA (as neutralizer) or add something lime Sodium xylene sulfonate.
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@ketchito thanks a lot ketchito.
Here I want to understand if we switch to TEA for neutralize labsa but how can we get the properties of NAOH if using TEA.
Can we use a combination of NAOH and TEA?
Does propylene glycol produce same effect as of SXS? Please reply. -
Assume this is not for sale in US?
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drjayseesunish said:drjayseesunish said:ketchito said:@drjayseesunish That’s a high amount of LABSA. I never got further than 8% without switching neutralizers (from NaOH to TEA) or adding a hydrotrope (like SXS). You could either reduce the amount of LABSA, switch to TEA (as neutralizer) or add something lime Sodium xylene sulfonate.PhilGeis said:Don’t see a preservative
@PhilGeis sorry..forget to mention
Phenoxyethanol is preservative used here.ketchito said:@drjayseesunish That’s a high amount of LABSA. I never got further than 8% without switching neutralizers (from NaOH to TEA) or adding a hydrotrope (like SXS). You could either reduce the amount of LABSA, switch to TEA (as neutralizer) or add something lime Sodium xylene sulfonate.ketchito said:@drjayseesunish That’s a high amount of LABSA. I never got further than 8% without switching neutralizers (from NaOH to TEA) or adding a hydrotrope (like SXS). You could either reduce the amount of LABSA, switch to TEA (as neutralizer) or add something lime Sodium xylene sulfonate.ketchito said:@drjayseesunish That’s a high amount of LABSA. I never got further than 8% without switching neutralizers (from NaOH to TEA) or adding a hydrotrope (like SXS). You could either reduce the amount of LABSA, switch to TEA (as neutralizer) or add something lime Sodium xylene sulfonate.ketchito said:@drjayseesunish That’s a high amount of LABSA. I never got further than 8% without switching neutralizers (from NaOH to TEA) or adding a hydrotrope (like SXS). You could either reduce the amount of LABSA, switch to TEA (as neutralizer) or add something lime Sodium xylene sulfonate.ketchito said:@drjayseesunish That’s a high amount of LABSA. I never got further than 8% without switching neutralizers (from NaOH to TEA) or adding a hydrotrope (like SXS). You could either reduce the amount of LABSA, switch to TEA (as neutralizer) or add something lime Sodium xylene sulfonate.@ketchito thanks a lot ketchito.
Here I want to understand if we switch to TEA for neutralize labsa but how can we get the properties of NAOH if using TEA.
Can we use a combination of NAOH and TEA?
Does propylene glycol produce same effect as of SXS? Please reply.@drjayseesunish When you neutralize with TEA, the resulting surfactant is more water soluble and also more degreasing than if you neutralize with NaOH. You could neutralize with both, but I’d recommend to firt use only TEA to see if your issue was resolved. Unfortunately, PPG is not as powerful as SXS, and it can also deprive your foam if used at high levels. I also see a high % of an alcohol ethoxylate. May I assume you’re formulating a concentrated liquid detergent (to be diluted)? Liquid enzymes would have been a good addition (but then you’d need to add stabilizers and redice the pH).
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PhilGeis said:Assume this is not for sale in US?
Yes..and I am not US citizen.???? any suggestions? Please
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It’s EPA’s “FIFRA” regulation - and you’re very unlikely to ever get challenged.
Preservatives in household products such as dish, clothes, cleaning detergents are regulated as pesticides and must be registered for that purpose with EPA. Without this - it’s an unregistered pesticide. I don’t think there’s a registered version of phenoxy.
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PhilGeis said:It’s EPA’s “FIFRA” regulation - and you’re very unlikely to ever get challenged.
Preservatives in household products such as dish, clothes, cleaning detergents are regulated as pesticides and must be registered for that purpose with EPA. Without this - it’s an unregistered pesticide. I don’t think there’s a registered version of phenoxy.
@PhilGeis this is very new information for me. Definitely keep in mind.
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ketchito said:drjayseesunish said:drjayseesunish said:ketchito said:@drjayseesunish That’s a high amount of LABSA. I never got further than 8% without switching neutralizers (from NaOH to TEA) or adding a hydrotrope (like SXS). You could either reduce the amount of LABSA, switch to TEA (as neutralizer) or add something lime Sodium xylene sulfonate.PhilGeis said:Don’t see a preservative
@PhilGeis sorry..forget to mention
Phenoxyethanol is preservative used here.ketchito said:@drjayseesunish That’s a high amount of LABSA. I never got further than 8% without switching neutralizers (from NaOH to TEA) or adding a hydrotrope (like SXS). You could either reduce the amount of LABSA, switch to TEA (as neutralizer) or add something lime Sodium xylene sulfonate.ketchito said:@drjayseesunish That’s a high amount of LABSA. I never got further than 8% without switching neutralizers (from NaOH to TEA) or adding a hydrotrope (like SXS). You could either reduce the amount of LABSA, switch to TEA (as neutralizer) or add something lime Sodium xylene sulfonate.ketchito said:@drjayseesunish That’s a high amount of LABSA. I never got further than 8% without switching neutralizers (from NaOH to TEA) or adding a hydrotrope (like SXS). You could either reduce the amount of LABSA, switch to TEA (as neutralizer) or add something lime Sodium xylene sulfonate.ketchito said:@drjayseesunish That’s a high amount of LABSA. I never got further than 8% without switching neutralizers (from NaOH to TEA) or adding a hydrotrope (like SXS). You could either reduce the amount of LABSA, switch to TEA (as neutralizer) or add something lime Sodium xylene sulfonate.ketchito said:@drjayseesunish That’s a high amount of LABSA. I never got further than 8% without switching neutralizers (from NaOH to TEA) or adding a hydrotrope (like SXS). You could either reduce the amount of LABSA, switch to TEA (as neutralizer) or add something lime Sodium xylene sulfonate.@ketchito thanks a lot ketchito.
Here I want to understand if we switch to TEA for neutralize labsa but how can we get the properties of NAOH if using TEA.
Can we use a combination of NAOH and TEA?
Does propylene glycol produce same effect as of SXS? Please reply.@drjayseesunish When you neutralize with TEA, the resulting surfactant is more water soluble and also more degreasing than if you neutralize with NaOH. You could neutralize with both, but I’d recommend to firt use only TEA to see if your issue was resolved. Unfortunately, PPG is not as powerful as SXS, and it can also deprive your foam if used at high levels. I also see a high % of an alcohol ethoxylate. May I assume you’re formulating a concentrated liquid detergent (to be diluted)? Liquid enzymes would have been a good addition (but then you’d need to add stabilizers and redice the pH).
@ketchito ok now I will try to make it accordingly your suggestions. You are saviour!
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Be aware - unlike cosmetics, preservation of household products is directed primarily at manufacturing - not consumer use.
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