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Advise for increasing viscosity of cream
Hi all I want your advise for increasing viscosity for cream containing(gms, ceteareth as emulsifiers, Cetearyl alcohol, oil and additifs)
Adding fragrance cream loose viscosity, which gelifiant is compatible(and best) for my system :
Neutralised carbomer, Xanthan gum, Hpmc, Hec, other…
@Paprik @Perry44 @chemicalmatt
@Abdullah @PhilGeis @Graillotion @Pharma others
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37 Replies
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Hi,
would be good to list all ingredients. Without knowing what exactly is in the formula I would say you are save using Xanthan Gum and HEC.
[HPMC is more suitable for foaming surfactant systems and Carbomer network is easily broken with electrolytes, unless you’re using electrolyte tolerant/resistant one].
Viscosity is build with waxy materials. So your rheology modifier might help with it, it might be better to use more waxy material to build the structure.
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Thanks alot, so the list ingredients is:
Water, mpg, sabowax AE, ceteareth 20,gms,parafin oil, petrolatum, Cetearyl alcohol, edta, citric acid, sensicare c1090, perfume (which cause loosing viscosity) . I eliminated hot process because cream already cold now that’s why I did not go with wax, Cetearyl alcohol…
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I hope I didn’t get it wrong, but I assume you’re adding your fragrance at around 45°C and with low shear. It that’s making you lose some viscosity, you could add some polymeric emulsifier like Sepigel 305 or Rheoluxe 812.
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Thanks for the information about adding fragrance with low shear around the 40°C I didn’t know about it is the any explanation and better process for adding fragrance (lower temperature, other shear …).
I will do researchement about your in put, just because I should correct quickly I made just try one with ultrez 21 and other with carbopol 996. Ultrez 21 gave better result but for economical reason I made correction with carbomer 996.
When I find occasion I will try some others corrections with :Hec, Hpmc, parafin wax, Cetearyl alcohol…
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I made some researchement about your input and it seems lovely one, just why formulator will go with them versus carbomers? Referring to (coast/quality)
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Any share please? @ketchito
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@Paprik any add?
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@Paprik any start point for Hec and xanthan gum?<div>
And for wax what about paraffin wax, have you better suggestions?
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Hi,
I am sorry, there is a loooot going on.
Hm, I do not use HEC in emulsions, I feel like it soaps a lot and .. yeah, never really grew to it.
I do use good grade of Xanthan Gum and usually my starting point is 0.4%, but again depending on formula.
I have never worked with paraffin wax, so I cannot help with this. It really depends how you want the product to perform and feel.
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Answer late better then not answering, I hate soap effect in cream almost reference use it between 0.2% and 0.3% the xanthan gum may I will try your level 0.4%.
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How much fragrance and that preservative is in your formula and what is the pH? That preservative and fragrance both reduce viscosity.
I use 0.005% fragrance in my lotions and it smell very well. You don’t need to add high amount of fragrance in a leave on emulsion.
For this batch you can add 0.2% xanthan gun in 1 or 2% glycerin and mix it with high shear mixer. Also add a preservative for fungi too.
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The level of perfume is near to 0.8% I know that’s soo high but I must work sush level, then sush level is not the reason because with other fragrances with same level I reached very better viscosity. The level of sensicare c 1090 is 0.8% when you make researchement this preservative is effective for bacteria, fungicide and yeast, so why you supposed to add some fungicide?
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It is not enough in my experience. I think it was 0.7 or 0.8% and pH 5-5.5.
You can try it. Make a 0.2% guar gum solution with 0.8% of this preservative and you will see.
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Thanks a lot what about adding 0.2% sodium benzoate?
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What is your pH?
Sodium benzoate is my most favorite anti fungal but i only make emulsions at pH 4-4.5.
I would increase it to 0.5% because it is inexpensive and very pH sensitive
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My ph 4.9 however have you reference for 0.5% level because from researchement I find in cosmetic it is used in 0.2% level.
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You should have 0.1% in acid form and at pH 4.9 only 16% is in acid form. With 0.2% you will only have 0.03% preservative.
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How did you calculate 16% please and with @PhilGeis do you think for pH between 5_5.5 combination 0.8%phenoxyethanol 0.2 sodium will be good for cream and no high ethoxylated cosmetic products?
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pH is sure on the high side, esp. for a cream. You need something for fungi. Maybe sorbate but stability can be an issue. Parabens would be best - if your policy allows. Can you find a combination with IPBC?
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So ipbc and parabens are allowed which type of parabens you recommend and their levels, and will be good combination 0.1% IPBC and 0.8 %phenoxyethanol. (I don’t know if I can find IPBC)
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methyl parabens 0.2%and propyl 0.1%
with phenoxy - phenonip[
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This reply was modified 1 month ago by PhilGeis.
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This reply was modified 1 month ago by
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Thanks a lot @PhilGeis for IPBC for leave on is it good 0.1% level?
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Think CIR has it up to 0.1% (you should check.. I’ve used it at much less, down to 100 ppm Issue with anything that low in % and low water solubility is adequate distribution in batch. Some dissolve in glycol
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If you can reduce pH to 4.5 or below, SB will work very well and it is inexpensive too.
IPBC is not very water soluble so dont forget to dissolve in first
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What is the reference of that curve please?
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Thanks @Abdullah if you can make screen shot the link did not open.
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Thanks a lot @Abdullah
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What do you think about 0.8% sensicare c 1090 as cosmetic preservative? @PhilGeis and @Abdullah take look for this I guess it is reference
https://www.ulprospector.com/fr/na/PersonalCare/Detail/124608/748120/SENSICARE-C-1090
ulprospector.com
SENSICARE C 1090 de Chemipol - Produits cosmétiques & de soins
SENSICARE C 1090 is a broad spectrum preservative for cosmetics specifically developed for controlling bacterial, fungal, and yeasticidal growth. Preser...
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If your batch is not so big, you can make another batch without fragrance and mix them.
Although i advise to always use 0.2% xanthan gun for viscosity and stability
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For the grade of xanthan gum that I have in only water(not emulsion) 0.2% did not give convinced viscosity and even in sensory aspect it is not lovely.
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In emulsion it is different, you have other types of thickeners too and they work in synergy.
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Thanks for this interesting add I suspect to synergy that’s why mentioned that 0.2% did not give convinced thickening effect(in water not in emulsion) . May I will try it when I have time.
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check out speigel 305!
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Thanks a lot @soapworksdupe
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