A soap problem - Chemists Corner

Formulating

A soap problem

Posted by belassi on October 8, 2019 at 8:46 pm

I don’t make much soap these days. Mainly for personal use. The problem:
The last few batches have failed. (cold process)
After mixing, the soap separates, voids occur filled with liquid. Here’s the last formula, a 1200 gram (weight of oil) batch:

water as % of oil weight: 40%
superfat: 5%
fragrance: ‘red berries’ 3% (we’ve used it before without problems)
lye conc: 25.8% (NaOH)
cocoa butter: 15%
coconut oil, virgin: 20%
safflower oil, high oleic: 40%
palm oil: 20%
castor oil: 5%

values were calculated with soapcalc as usual.
On mixing and blending, the reaction seemed to be going too fast. It wasn’t expected to be fast; the relatively high % of water and oleic oil should have made it fairly slow. About 20 min after putting in the mould, the soap began separating, voids and oil pockets developed.

I am beginning to think that perhaps our palm oil has gone off. It doesn’t smell bad though. However this is about the fourth failed batch. Has anyone any ideas?

Will replied 4 years, 11 months ago 8 Members · 12 Replies
12 Replies

ChemicalPyros

Member
October 9, 2019 at 4:54 am

It seems to me a temperature problem, it happened and still happens with me (temperature differences between summer and winter). I suggest that you change the temperature and try it on a lower temperature.
Fekher

Member
October 9, 2019 at 12:28 pm

@Belassi try hot process it will almost give better resultats .
David08848

Member
October 9, 2019 at 4:02 pm

My soap formulas use water at the rate of 2.5 X the amount of the lye and yours is even higher than that at 2.87. I put it through SoapCalc myself, which I don’t normally use, and got the numbers you came up with. I think the key here might be your temperature as was mentioned above. Belassi, what temperature so you use for both your oil phase AND your lye phase? Both are important! I am typically in the 100-110F range for both…sometimes lower…
belassi

Member
October 9, 2019 at 9:06 pm

I forgot to measure the temperature but I could comfortably hold the container without gloves. Probably about 45C.
mikethair

Member
October 11, 2019 at 8:33 am

We make a lot of soap. And from what you have described, I would be looking first at the “fragrance: ‘red berries’ 3% .” Do you have a CoA for the fragrance? Is it the same as the previous CoA?
belassi

Member
October 11, 2019 at 2:48 pm

It’s a different fragrance from the previous one. We had run out and the supplier had changed it. Yes, it could be the cause.
smok

Member
October 13, 2019 at 12:53 pm

try this you would forget all your receips

Almond oil   220 gr

Coconut oil 118

Olive oil
107

Coca butter 107

Shea butter
  82

Casto oil
51

Avocado oil 15

NAOH   93 gr

Water 205 gr

Total 998 gr
belassi

Member
October 13, 2019 at 5:54 pm

Sounds terribly expensive.
smok

Member
October 13, 2019 at 7:16 pm

you can use soapcalc and change some products
David08848

Member
October 14, 2019 at 1:01 am

Belassi said:

It’s a different fragrance from the previous one. We had run out and the supplier had changed it. Yes, it could be the cause.

It must be the cause!
Gene

Member
October 20, 2019 at 11:03 pm

My first guess was fragrance also.
Will

Member
December 11, 2019 at 4:34 am

@Belassi once I tried to make a soap with similar ingredients than yours (hot process ~140F), as the fragrance I had an old bottle of Coco Chanel that I decided to give it a go… when I added that the temperature spiked up like crazy in seconds, like scorching smoking hot, and it hardened almost immediately. It was the weirdest reaction I have seen in my cosmetics adventures.

I have no idea what in the fragrance would give this unexpected reaction. Maybe I should have waited it to cool down more, but I was afraid of it hardening too much. Anyways, since that episode I have been scared of adding fragrances during my soap processes, as I feel they are kind of unpredictable.