[stephanm]

@David08848: thanks for your advice. I’ll pass that on. I was hearing that “KOH + water + oils -> paste” stage took around 3 hours, so I’m surprised to see that it only takes 10 minutes for you. Will inquire!

[stephanm]

Are there any of these lovely ‘electric all-in-one double boiler’ machines that are less than $4-5k? They look fantastic but are a bit out of our budget.. perhaps I could find a used one up in Vancouver (Canada)..

[stephanm]

@Bobzchemist: great advice, thanks. Understood. So - we ought to have a much safer and controlled way of ‘double boiling’ during our saponification stage. The products you just shared look great, if not a bit expensive - but totally opens up my mind re: what I should be looking into!

I’m curious - you mention that there’s ‘nothing wrong’ with double boiling to make our base soap gel; does this imply that there are perhaps other methods that I might explore?

Our base soap gel is simply water + potassium hydroxide + olive/coconut oil.

And thanks again!

[stephanm]

@Bobzchemist: the partner who makes the soap learned the double boiling method at a local ‘soap making school’. Pot inside an even larger pot which is filled with boiling water. This is the basis for the saponification stage (which takes 3+ hours of heating, occasionally mixing, etc., until gel!)

I think you’re telling me that this method is very… ‘arts and crafts’ style, and not something that might scale?

What would you recommend as a safer way of heating batches?

Also, regarding a slow stirring mixer - I suppose this would be used for everything post-saponification stage. A high speed immersion blender has no more use post-saponification, correct?

[stephanm]

@Bobzchemist: thanks for the links! Indeed I’ve seen you recommend that “commercial immersion blender” before in another thread. 

To be clear: this blender would be used during the saponification stage (where we’re mixing water/olive (or coconut) oil/potassium hydroxide over a double boiler to create the ‘paste’, etc)?

[stephanm]

@Bobzchemist:

These steps come after we produce the saponified oils of coconut and olive.

We have jugs of each of these 2 oils; pre-produced, since it takes about 5 hours to finish the saponification procedure.

If the saponification procedure is what you’d like to know more about, please let me know. It involves the big pot, mixing, a stove, and a stick blender at times, etc., as you’d expect to find in a home ‘liquid body wash’ making hobby.

So, starting with our 2 saponified oils and the rest of the ingredeints:

1) Mix xanthan gum into glycerine (by hand, at room temperature..) (switching to guar gum)

2) Mix saponified oils of coconut and olive oil with (golden) jojoba oil and aloe vera (by hand, at room temperature)

3) Slowly mix #1 and #2 together. (by hand, at room temperature)

4) Add essential oils to the mix

5) Mix everything together (by hand..)

There’s no heat involved (except for during the production of the saponified oils of coconut and olive), and we haven’t used any machines except for a stick blender during the saponification of the base 2 ingredients.

Again - this has all been farmers market stuff; of wildly inconsistent texture and clearly inferior homogenization.

I guess what I’m really trying to learn is what kind of machinery should we be using during the above steps.

As an aside, our company’s historial sales have been essential oils, essential oil blends, essential oil ‘roller ball’ sticks, etc. This body wash product is aiming to be a new line, and will fit into the ‘natural and infused with essential oils’ branding. 

@Belassi: we’re OK to live in the niche world. As an example of a niche body wash that lives in the world of “natural ingredients”, there’s Defense Soap, amongst others: http://www.defensesoap.com/defense-soap-shower-gel.html

[stephanm]

@Perry: for various reasons (amongst them being that one of our founding members is really passionate about making everything herself) we have decided to keep production in-house.

@Bobzchemist: I’ve browsed a few topics on this site and indeed you appear to be the master wizard here! Thanks for the response!

Our current batches are not big. We’re talking less than 10 litres. One of our directors is a veteran investor, and I myself have raised funds for other companies in another sector - so we have the means and desire to invest some money into scaling up. 

Having said that - I’m interested in your first idea. The one that involves scaling up ‘to the next step’. I think we’re going to enter a phase where we spend 6 months giving out samples, marketing into private institutions through various channels we have, etc. I think we can invest a few thousand on equipment during this phase, and leave the larger scale investments (the $20k you mentioned) until later.

I’ll get back to you ASAP with the current production procedure. My partner will have to explain it to me!

Regarding the big commercial stick blender, overhead mixer, pots and lids - and I realize I’m asking a bit much here - would you happen to have a specific recommendation for each? As in, a link to a product you think is most suitable?

Thanks for your time-